Welcome Guest! The IOSH forums are a free resource to both members and non-members. Login or register to use them

Postings made by forum users are personal opinions. IOSH is not responsible for the content or accuracy of any of the information contained in forum postings. Please carefully consider any advice you receive.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Admin  
#1 Posted : 11 October 2008 14:56:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 Background: There must be a sufficient number of toilets and washing facilities so that people should not have to queue for long periods to use them. These should be separate for male and female, unless you have a very small number of staff. The facilities must be clean, and provided with toilet paper, soap, drying facilities, and hot and cold running water. They must be well lit, and ventilated to the external air. Sometimes a shower may be necessary. However, there is no mention of distances. Any ideas anybody of persuasive arguments to overcome reluctance to provide toilets nearer than 200M away and which are across a busy open bus depot at the mercy of all weathers at all times? Or is there any authoritative guidance available covering this aspect? Geoff
Admin  
#2 Posted : 12 October 2008 18:50:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By James M Are you talking about construction site or permanent work place?
Admin  
#3 Posted : 12 October 2008 21:08:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 Permanent but happy to see responses to both scenarios.
Admin  
#4 Posted : 13 October 2008 11:40:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Smiff Neither the 200m or the weather would concern me, but if they have to cross vehicle areas I'd say this is a risk that need to be addressed in some way.
Admin  
#5 Posted : 13 October 2008 13:15:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Mitch Geoff, In the absence of authoritative guidance I would refer the the Workplace (Health, Safety and Welfare) Regulations which state (a number of times)that facilities have to be 'Suitable, sufficient AND readily accessible' from your description crossing a bus depot is not readily accessible especially for the specific requirement for pregnant women and nursing mothers. It also refers to traffic control! Mitch Thank goodness the spell checker is working
Admin  
#6 Posted : 13 October 2008 14:42:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Toby Thorp This should make an 'interesting' entry for my first post on the site .... .... but you might want to check the so called 'Bog' Standard aka BS 6465. That makes reference to toilets provided in a permanent stationary workplace such that staff should not have to walk more than 100m to reach a toilet. I have some of my own notes in front of me which tell me that it might be in section 5.2.2.1 or 6.4.1 but I haven't double checked that. It also incidentally recommends that people should not have to travel up or down more than one floor either to achieve their toiletry needs. This would be one of those subjects where I almost wish I didn't know these facts... TT
Admin  
#7 Posted : 13 October 2008 16:01:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By jervis Check out 6pack regs
Admin  
#8 Posted : 13 October 2008 17:02:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 Thanks Toby, a useful reference which I will try and dig up. The difficulty with that though is that there are hundreds of BSs, it costs to join BS, and being a member only allows only slightly cheaper access to the very expensive publications. Which puts them, in my opinion, out of the range of most small companies. Unlike the HSE of course which reasonably price most publications. Jervis, that is most peoples port of call and possibly (although I doubt it) I've missed the link about distances. Perhaps you would reference it more specifically?
Admin  
#9 Posted : 13 October 2008 17:08:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By jervis 1-5 people 1toilet 1wash basin 6-25 people 2toilets 2wash basins 26-50 people 3 toilets 3wash basins 51-75 people 4 wash toilets 4 washbasins 76-100 toilets 5 washbasins Where members of the public use them more toilets possibly seperate.
Admin  
#10 Posted : 13 October 2008 17:15:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 .... and where does it mention distance, the whole point of this query?
Admin  
#11 Posted : 13 October 2008 17:44:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By TT I agree that there are no distances mentioned in the 6 pack, let alone the Workplace Regs. To the best of my knowledge (and I've dealt with several toilet based queries, complaints etc. over the last few years) the only distance mentioned is this one in the BS (I've double checked and it is in section 6.4.1 (e) relating to workplaces. I'd copy and paste if I thought I could get away with it but shan't for obvious reasons. Its actually pretty much as I've written anyway. I'm sure I won't need to make the comment on the BS's lack of legal status though so 'authoritative' guidance remains lacking I'm afraid. Your decision on suitable and sufficient should probably be guided by the numbers of people expected to be using the toilets in addition to the aforementioned traffic issues. ... Also bear in mind that there might be individuals who find themselves unexpectedly experiencing a call of nature (for reasons of medicine, illness, age or otherwise) and 200m could prove a little too much for them.....
Admin  
#12 Posted : 13 October 2008 17:51:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 Thanks Toby/TTB for the references - very useful.
Admin  
#13 Posted : 13 October 2008 17:54:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By TT Same person...just changed the display name. Wouldn't want you to wrongly think you'd got a double endorsement of the British Standard! ;)
Admin  
#14 Posted : 13 October 2008 19:07:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By IOSH Moderator Geoff I have trawled through everything I have, and can't find any legal reason why the WC's 'must' be within XXX metres etc. Whilst not specifically addressing your question (and I apologise for deviating) I have never ever come across a company that would not have WC's as close to the working base as possible, to avoid of course the wasted times whilst taking a toilet break. Numbers yes, distances no; simply can't find any reference to give a precise answer. CFT
Admin  
#15 Posted : 14 October 2008 09:20:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 James M, I'd be happy to see your perspective, as you indicate there is a difference between permanent toilets and those on construction sites?
Admin  
#16 Posted : 14 October 2008 09:44:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Crim I frequently inspect shop fitting sites, mostly new units with little or no welfare facilities in place. Sometimes there has been restrictions placed on the contractor by the landlord and the contractor may have just one thunder box on site, with its own supply of cold water. On one recent visit there was a welfare cabin at the rear of the unit with an electricity supply inside the unit. The landlord would not allow the contractor to drill through the rear wall to feed a cable to the cabin. I have to accept for a short period of time to allow the use of neighboring welfare facilities, i.e. the local cafe or supermarket until a decent electrical supply can be provided to heat water etc. This is only for a short period of time and would not be acceptable as permanent. I am aware of a recent health and safety executive inspector commenting on a permanent toilet facility that was portable cabins, fully plumbed and supplied with hot water, even showers. The inspector said she would have expect something more permanent as the facility had been there for a few years.
Admin  
#17 Posted : 15 October 2008 09:36:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 Thanks all for the responses. I would like to hear James M view?
Admin  
#18 Posted : 15 October 2008 09:49:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Mitch Geoff, For a bit of further info'/advice do a quick search the proximity of welfare facilities at construction sites was discussed on this forum recently. Mitch
Admin  
#19 Posted : 15 October 2008 12:57:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 Thanks Mitch, but I only get my own back!! over the last year?
Admin  
#20 Posted : 15 October 2008 13:39:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Mitch Geoff, Try this one, http://www.iosh.co.uk/in...iew&forum=1&thread=36311 Regards Mitch
Admin  
#21 Posted : 15 October 2008 14:02:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Ian G Hutchings Hi Geoff As mentioned earlier in the post, it sounds like your main issue here is one of workplace transport hazards. You could undertake a risk assessment using the HSE workplace transport assessment in support of the position of the toilets and safe access. They may not be overly interested in the distance, but the implications of someone being struck by a bus on the way and potential consequences to them personally may raise interest. Ian
Admin  
#22 Posted : 15 October 2008 17:00:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By GeoffB4 Thanks Mitch/Ian Don't understand why my search missed it. Interesting leaflet from HSE who suggest 10 minutes in a temporary construction environment - which I would consider to be worst case and can use in the case we are discussing. Also will use the transport side of things as well. I have to admit at exasperation with some responses on this board but there has been an excellent response to this query - thanks all.
Users browsing this topic
Guest
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.