Posted By Ron Hunter Presumably no IN or PN arising from that visit then - so it can't be all bad can it? Suggest your Client is in a position to demonstrate at the meeting adequate arrangements for CDM & CAR compliance and ensuring competency of his appointments. There is a tendency here and there for HSE to keep cards close to their chests. The Inspector obviously has a key concern or two.

Posted By Peter F. As the HSE inspector is playing cards close to chest then then, there's little advice can be given here. as said if no notices have been served it can't all be bad. Why did he visit in the first place? Was it routine? did someone report something was amiss? Had the company dismissed someone? Normally some indication is given as to why they have visited. Do your own inspection, i.e. look at the paperwork, check tools are in good order, competency of contractors etc. anything amiss, put it in place if you can.

Posted By D H Crim - why not phone him and ask what you need to have ready for the meeting? Dave

Posted By gerry d Crim I have limited experience of HSE inspectors. Mostly positive I have to say. The inspector in this case probably has concerns about something. But they are human and you should try not to be too intimidated about the meeting. Don`t be too deferential and only respond to what is asked, nothing else. The more information you give, the more he is likely to dig. Inspectors usually issue a letter when a visit has been undertaken and `issues` have arisen even though IN or PN is not issued. Contacting them is a good suggestion and might give you an idea what the meeting agenda might be. Good luck.

Posted By TBC It could also be that the Inspector wants to satisfy him/herself that the company is being looked after H&S wise by someone and they have a good knowledge of their client. I only ever had to visit clients with the HSE there on two occasions and they were 'new' clients with improvement notices - hence new clients. Your client may (in the HSE inspectors eyes) need some improvements or adjustments and the meeting with all concerned will ensure a way forward, but certainly phone and see if you can assist before hand. Some HSE Inspectors can be a bit picky.

Posted By Dave Wilson MMMM!! Alarm bells ringing. I would most definitely find out what its about and ask if he will be needing legal representation, there is nothing worse than going there, being cautioned and served. Ambushed is the word!!! remember that you are not compelled to go the HSE and they do not have powers to summon you or arrest you. Depends how much you want to upset them? Come into my den and play with me please and I have all the Aces. Find out what's what mate

Posted By GeoffB4 Have I missed something - surely the client will know what it is about?

Posted By Toe Crim, Has the inspector specifically invited you (as the clients consultant) to the meeting? I have in the past been involved with inspectors that will not allow an external consultant to be present at such meetings or allow any correspondences from them. Has anyone else experienced this?

Posted By Crim Hi, Yes my name is on the list of required attendees. The MD has responded positively and addressed all matters raised by the inspector. My fears are that the MD does not quite realise the seriousness of the situation as he sees all issues as minor. He thinks now that all issues heve been sorted the inspector will not carry out any further action. Should I fear the worst, and then if it's not that bad we will wonder what the fuss was about? Or should we just ride it out and then possibly get hit with the "big stick"?

Posted By Crim Frank, Thanks for your input - I now feel like a dead man walking!

Posted By FAH Crim - you have mail Frank Hallett

Posted By Pandatank Crim, I wouldn't worry too much about it as the size of the stick is not likely to be that big.(I should know as I was an HSE Inspector for 3 years) Dave Wilson's suspicions are highly unlikely and would in effect breach the PACE code of practice and result in any prosecution being thrown out of court. Notices would need to be served in a timely fashion (PNs immediately or in deferred PNs once the immediate danger to workers has been made safe) and the Inspector would have told you if his intention was to serve a notice. It may be that the inspector has perceived fundamental flaws in the H&S management system in place and wishes to implement a "managed intervention" plan. This is often the case where the inspector suspects there is no real commitment to H&S at Board/Director level and no management system in place (on the "factory floor" not sitting on a shelf). The Notices issued (and perhaps the MD's attitude) suggest a 'casual' approach to H&S and a culture of taking "shortcuts" (the safety barriers were available but not being used). I suspect the Inspector wants the MD to take H&S seriously and wants you there to estimate the time it will take to achieve agreed "milestones" within the plan. eg. rollout of training, monitoring H7S performance etc. It could also be that Shop "fitouts" tend to hover on the border of being Notifiable under CDM and the company doesn't "appear" to be aware of these regulations.

Posted By Dave Wilson Its interesting really that we have different experiences with the Enforcement agencies. I would personally find out what it's all about. I agree that it would be unlikely to get paced / ambushed but it is possible, best to go prepared as you may have solutions already thought of and this would be better than the HSE suggesting them for you. Interesting it is the ex / serving [reference removed] who advocate that you haver nothing to worry about, obviously reasonable people but hey are not all reasonable, you do get the odd git so to speak!

Posted By Healthy Debate They like Custard Creams, oh and Ginger nuts are good too! Let's hope the inspector has a "common sense" approach, eh Judith!

Posted By Luke. Rob, Can't see S36 coming in here.. Crim stated at the start:- "I used to visit their sites regularly and write reports to the MD until a while ago they decided this was not necessary. I have spoken to the MD and he has agreed to reintroduce my site visits. All issues picked up by the inspector are on my check list so would have been addressed prior to the visit (hopefully)?" So he used to visit the sites but i'm assuming at the time of HSE inspection, the MD had already decided that he didn't want Crim visiting anymore... so its out of his hands.. unless i've missed something...

Posted By Homer Inspectors are only doing a job. If no IN's or PN's raised it will almost certainly be about CDM. Just lift the phone ring him and ask they won't bite.

Posted By Luke. Dave is right. We had one issued on a saturday many moons ago, issue was complied with there and then. still on the HSE website.

Posted By Bob Y PN's can be withdrawn by an Inspector under Section 23 (5) which states "Where an improvement notice or a prohibition notice which is not to take immediate effect has been served — (a) the notice may be withdrawn by an inspector at any time before the end of the period specified therein..."

Posted By Bob Y Scary stuff indeed, and although a visit, announced or otherwise by the HSE does get my heart rate up a bit they are in the main courteous, sensible etc. OK, so there is always the Inspector from hell but they are generally few and far between. My overall experience of the HSE inspectors has been very positive, and they can be quite helpful at times if you need to give the boss a bit of a nudge. In saying that, if something does go seriously wrong, then I would not expect them to cut me any slack. I think that the terminology is that PNs are 'satisfied'. PNs do not have to take immediate effect and CAN be withdrawn by the inspector if the reason for the PN has been remedied before the PN was due to come into effect. I don't think that interviews under S20 are 'PACED' (but happy to be wrong) Hope all goes ok, I really don't see any reason to be too concerned about S36, PACE etc.

Posted By Graham Bullough Although it doesn’t seem to be the case in the scenario described by Crim, it is possible for an HSE inspector to serve a Prohibition Notice (PN) and then subsequently learn for some reason that it wasn’t valid or appropriate. After all, inspectors are people and just as subject to misunderstandings and mistakes as anyone else. From my 10 years as an HSE inspector I recall carrying a pad of A5 size Notice Withdrawal forms (not sure of exact title) along with a pad of PNs and Improvement Notices (INs) plus statement forms. Although I don’t recall ever needing to use a withdrawal form, I think that they could be used for formally withdrawing PNs (immediate and deferred) as well as INs. However, as my recollection goes back to 1987, can any serving or more recent inspectors who read this confirm the existence of withdrawal forms and their actual title? Also, has anyone ever seen an issued withdrawal form? If so, can you outline why it was issued? Generally it seems that HSE inspectors (and their counterparts with local authority environmental health departments) issue INs and PNs appropriately. Just as the Robens Committee identified in their 1972 Report, I found them to be very useful inspectorial tools for getting things done/improved practically with minimal bureaucracy. However, before serving any notice, any competent inspector should obtain evidence to support it, not least to justify its issue at a tribunal if the recipient decides to appeal against it for any reason. This would probably help to explain why the inspector mentioned by Crim took a photo. Also the process of gathering simple supporting evidence (e.g. photo and/or statement/s from say a couple of employees) no doubt reinforces the inspector’s intent and that the related notice is something to be taken seriously by the recipient. p.s. Have just used the spellchecker on this response: Among other words it queried "Robens" and suggested Rubens, Robins and Robina among others as alternatives to staying with "Robens"!