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Monopoly  
#1 Posted : 02 October 2019 14:31:36(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Monopoly

I have been informed that all lifts used for evacuation use must meet BS 9999 Annex G (fire regulations). 

According to the Fire Strategy for our office building (which was written in 2012) 

3.4.2 Where evacuation lifts are provided (2No.) they have been designed and installed in accordance with the relevant provisions in BS 8300, BS EN 81-1 or BS EN 81-2, and BS EN 81-70.

I'm aware that BS EN 81-1 and BS EN 81-2 have been updated, but does this mean that our lifts do not comply anymore and cannot be used as evacuation lifts?

Thanks

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score  
#2 Posted : 02 October 2019 14:56:21(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
score

There are NO lifts that are used or should be used for evacuating people! There are Fire Fighting Lifts that are solely used to get fire fighting equipment up to where it needs to be in high rise buildings. But these will have to be classified  as Fire Fighting Lifts before the Fire Brigade can use them.

Roundtuit  
#3 Posted : 02 October 2019 15:10:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

BS 9999:2017 Appendix G.2 Does speak of evacuation lifts as a means of planned escape from a refuge (rather than a Fire Fighters lift used to move equipment). Design & Installation is cited as BS EN 81-20 & BS EN 81-70 and mentions a secondary power supply according to the recommendations of BS 8519.

Building Regulations are rarely retrospective - if you have concern talk to the architect

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Monopoly on 02/10/2019(UTC), Monopoly on 02/10/2019(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#4 Posted : 02 October 2019 15:10:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

BS 9999:2017 Appendix G.2 Does speak of evacuation lifts as a means of planned escape from a refuge (rather than a Fire Fighters lift used to move equipment). Design & Installation is cited as BS EN 81-20 & BS EN 81-70 and mentions a secondary power supply according to the recommendations of BS 8519.

Building Regulations are rarely retrospective - if you have concern talk to the architect

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Monopoly on 02/10/2019(UTC), Monopoly on 02/10/2019(UTC)
Monopoly  
#5 Posted : 02 October 2019 15:13:45(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Monopoly

Originally Posted by: score Go to Quoted Post

There are NO lifts that are used or should be used for evacuating people! There are Fire Fighting Lifts that are solely used to get fire fighting equipment up to where it needs to be in high rise buildings. But these will have to be classified  as Fire Fighting Lifts before the Fire Brigade can use them.

Please google BS9999 Annex G

achrn  
#6 Posted : 02 October 2019 15:30:49(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
achrn

Originally Posted by: score Go to Quoted Post

There are NO lifts that are used or should be used for evacuating people!

There are lifts for evacuation of people.

BS9999:2017, says (clause15.8) "Lifts that are specifically designated for the purpose can, however, be used to evacuate people safely and effectively".

Section 45.9 is a whole section titled "Evacuation using lifts".  It starts "A lift to be used for the evacuation of disabled people should usually be either an evacuation lift or a firefighters lift,".  It even says "A lift that is not explicitly designed for evacuation may be used for evacuation, provided that it provides the same functionality as an evacuation lift. If this is to be considered as an option then a suitable risk assessment should be undertaken to evaluate whether the lift meets the recommendations given in Annex G".  Annex G is titled "Recommendations for refuges and evacuation lifts".

Noting that the current BS9999 says that even a lift that has not been designed as an evacuation lift could possibly be used as one (subject to an assessment against Annex G), possibly the OP would be able to obtain (or undertake) such an assessment.  None of my premises have lifts that we've designated for use in evacuation, however, so it's not anything I've ever tackled.  (Actually, our only building with a lift has one that makes every engneer that sees it for the first time suck their teeth, though they do eventually give it its LOLER or whatever they are here for - it's unusual, but not dangerous, I believe.)

In general, updated BSs and Building Regs don't apply retrospectively, but that's not to say that some regulation hasn't been updated to refer to the latest BS / regs.

Edited by user 02 October 2019 15:33:07(UTC)  | Reason: grocers apostrophe (the shame)

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Monopoly on 02/10/2019(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#7 Posted : 02 October 2019 15:44:40(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

To be fair many commercial Fire Action notices that get liberally slapped around premises tend to mention "in the event of fire do not use lift" so there is a general presumption a lift should never be used.

I am currently staring at such a notice installed by a predecessor - and we don't have a lift on the premises!

Roundtuit  
#8 Posted : 02 October 2019 15:44:40(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

To be fair many commercial Fire Action notices that get liberally slapped around premises tend to mention "in the event of fire do not use lift" so there is a general presumption a lift should never be used.

I am currently staring at such a notice installed by a predecessor - and we don't have a lift on the premises!

score  
#9 Posted : 03 October 2019 07:17:51(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
score

There are hardly any Fire Fighting Lifts available as the specification for these is really expensive (completely seperate "clean" electric supply) for example.

They are normally installed in high rise buildings and their purpose is to help get equipment up to the higher floors.

Monopoly how many floors are there in your building/s??

Monopoly  
#10 Posted : 03 October 2019 09:07:32(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Monopoly

It's not a particularly tall building , but the main meeting and function rooms are on the third floor (dont ask me why).

The main reason for the evacuation lifts is that we hold functions on the third floor and we get a lot of people attending in wheel chairs. 

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