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Kim Hedges  
#1 Posted : 18 March 2020 12:04:30(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kim Hedges

So here we are on the 18th March 2020. 2000 confirmed cases of covid19 in the UK, 71 deaths so far. While in Italy there are 24,747 cases, Germany 4838, France 5380, Spain 7753. It is estimated that the UK is 15 days behind Italy. The UK Government has provided £330,000,000, 000.00 (330 Billion Pounds). UK subjects are asked not to travel abroad for 30 days, but many countries have already closed their borders, making international travel difficult. Airlines and Airports are running at reduced capacity or closed down. A news item yesterday showed Trucks delivering goods from Poland into Germany, stuck on the border, there was a 42 km queue. Many SME companies have been closed, millions of people are in isolation in the UK, whilst in Europe they have travel bans and fines for those who would break these new laws. The North Pole has already had 1 confirmed case on a research ship previously isolated, South Africa has had it's first cases plus 30 other countries. Russia has just started building a new hospital for their expected cases, but the local workers don't seem to be aware of covid19 at all - meaning the Russian press are not reporting it much! Many people are now effected worldwide, in China where it was first discovered 3 months ago (31st December 2019) their peak seems to have passed, but they still have cases. The UK Gov expect 20,000 deaths in the UK alone and really we are just beginning.

I will continue to post stuff, I would suggest IOSH members contribute, simply as a record of how we have dealt with this most recent personal assault on our humanity.  Just think, if you are still alive in 30 years time, you will probably start sentences with 'When we had the coronavirus in 2020 we.....' 

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Andy Cressy on 18/03/2020(UTC), Banham30689 on 25/03/2020(UTC)
Andy Cressy  
#2 Posted : 18 March 2020 14:45:15(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Andy Cressy

There have been a lot of discussions on DSE assessments for home workers. I work for a housing association and we need to still provide a repairs and emergency service. I am feilding calls from operatives daily asking What to Do and What PPE should I wear.

I am in the process of reviewing and writing RA's specifically for this situation. Any advise welcome.

Thanks

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Kim Hedges on 18/03/2020(UTC)
Mark-W  
#3 Posted : 18 March 2020 14:52:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Mark-W

Originally Posted by: Andy Cressy Go to Quoted Post

There have been a lot of discussions on DSE assessments for home workers. I work for a housing association and we need to still provide a repairs and emergency service. I am feilding calls from operatives daily asking What to Do and What PPE should I wear.

I am in the process of reviewing and writing RA's specifically for this situation. Any advise welcome.

Thanks

Andy, 1 of my clients is an FM company. We've implemented a more stringent hand washing regime, whenever they enter a clients promises (all commercial) they are to wash their hands or use hand gel if available, and then as when needed throughout the job, but then to wash their hands again before they leave.

We looked at masks and decided that FFP2 masks would be provided if requested or stipulated by client. We've had an ex client approach us to see if we would enter student accomodation if there is anyone self isolating in any of the flats. We said yes but not into the exact flat the isolation was taking place. We had a few engrs say no, but that was because they either lived at home with elderly parents or had children with health issues. Which we fully understand.

We looked at disposable suits but decided that they weren't a viable option.But we would buy disposable booties, if requested by engrs.

Apart from that we haven't changed much. But before we despatch an engr to a client site we ask 3 questions.

1. Do you have any confirmed coronavirus cases or any self isolation cases

2. Are there any areas that are out of bounds to our engrs due to coronavirus

3. Are there any specific requirements you have for our engrs.

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Andy Cressy on 18/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 18/03/2020(UTC), Toki on 23/03/2020(UTC)
Andy Cressy  
#4 Posted : 18 March 2020 15:11:02(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Andy Cressy

Thanks for the info. Its an evolving situation. Most our properties are tenanted so not easy to deal with, and when they want a repair they may not be completly honest with the answers. We are asking the same questions of our clients, and asking our teams for any information that could present risk to them or family memebers.

Im sure there will be plenty of questions on this subject moving foward. Thanks to the members of this forum for their advice and comments in advance.

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Kim Hedges on 18/03/2020(UTC)
Mark-W  
#5 Posted : 18 March 2020 16:01:36(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Mark-W

Originally Posted by: Andy Cressy Go to Quoted Post

Thanks for the info. Its an evolving situation. Most our properties are tenanted so not easy to deal with, and when they want a repair they may not be completly honest with the answers. We are asking the same questions of our clients, and asking our teams for any information that could present risk to them or family memebers.

Im sure there will be plenty of questions on this subject moving foward. Thanks to the members of this forum for their advice and comments in advance.

It's hard isn't it. It puts our helpdesk in a hard position when they ask the questions, you have to take the answers at face value. Only for the engr to arive at site and find a completely different set of circumstances

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Kim Hedges on 18/03/2020(UTC)
RayRapp  
#6 Posted : 18 March 2020 21:05:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

It certainly is a grim situation, never seen anything like it in my lifetime.

Perhaps this whole business can be used as a wake-up call for the future. It appears to me we are not very well prepared for such an event. For example, the NHS is under pressure, too little nurses, doctors, beds, hospitals, etc. And, we may not have seen the worst of it yet!

Thank God it's not a more serious virus like an Ebola. The world needs to be better prepared - just in case there is a similar event in the future. We need to invest more in prevention and the production of vaxines. 

Take care. 

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Kim Hedges on 18/03/2020(UTC), Toki on 23/03/2020(UTC)
Kim Hedges  
#7 Posted : 18 March 2020 23:15:51(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kim Hedges

Seems there is a trend starting as far as C19 news in this country (UK), 1500 hrs seems to be when the previous 24 hours death toll is announced, today it's 104.  So using the estimation used in the computer models of 1 death eaquals 1000 other possible uncinfirmed cases, we have 104,000. people who may have it.  Confirmed cases 2626 in the UK.

As the hospital testing is still in it's infancy, only a blood test seems to be the most accurate (so far) and that blood test has to be looked at by somebody who knows what to look for.  Last week there was a (somebody in Btistol I think) group looking at an after infection test, looking at the skin excretion of the virus.  That may come in next week and then into mass production.  PPE is still worrysome for many NHS staff, mostly the lack of it.   

Despite the Government asking for people to self isolate and not to go clubbing and pubbing, news from last nights St.Patricks day festivities show a blatant disregard for anybody else (that was a TV news report in Manchester with Sky News).  It follows, that the UK will no doubt follow on from most Federal countries and make it an official ban possibly with a curfew - as so many idiots won't take telling (so a bit like safety in general terms)? 

Many Contractors in contracts at the moment, maybe losing their jobs shortly, not because of lack of work, but lack of other people to to the work, such as Managers and fulltime staff.  Network Rail is in this position apparently. 

Small enterprises like coffee and cake shops have had to lay off most of their staff as people are self isolating and also not in work, so they don't need the daily things that would normally be bought. 

Contruction companies are also in precarious waters, with people going sick, self isolation and social distancing making it difficult to work.  Contracts for outside contractors have stopped, such things as Crane contracts to lift timber onto new houses, pipework and airconditioning, all such common contracts that were expected this last 2 weeks.  Now there is almost nothing across the whole of the UK. 

Keep posting your work related woes.

chris42  
#8 Posted : 19 March 2020 09:46:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

Why is everyone buying all the toilet paper? The issue seems to be about your respiratory tract and lungs with the possibility of getting pneumonia? Can’t seem to find anything to suggests it will give you diarrhoea etc. So why is everyone buying toilet rolls? ( in members forum PC has stopped supplying and individuals have to take their own)

Chris

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A Kurdziel on 19/03/2020(UTC), Aleksandra on 19/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#9 Posted : 19 March 2020 09:57:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

One thing that never ceases to amaze me is how this country likes to talk itself in to a corner and then acts surprised when it manifests its perceptions as reality.

We had it during the financial crisis and we have just had it with stock piling - show the same empty shelf twenty times a day on TV and the public will go and panic buy. The difference this time round is that not only do we have journalists being sensationalist but we have the informal connectivity without check or balance in social media.

Rather than lambast the public lets discuss the unscupulous behaviour of the stores themsleves in permitting this to happen who have the computer data to see very early and very frequently what is happening in their stores. Worse they then try to appear as white knights offering specific opening hours for particular groups and limiting the number of items that may be purchased.

"Marvin" H&S is about proprtionallity in risk, unfortunately we all see risk differently. Government advice regarding gatherings was not "self isolation" and at the time we were also not being asked to socially distance. Yes it did appear strange for Manchester to continue with its St Patrick's day parade, particulalrly when New York and Dublin had cancelled theirs, but it was down to the assessment of the council in consultation with the emergency services. Personally I did not attend even though it is normally a great event.

Better still lets try and think. Many people are at home either self isolating, looking after kids or instructed to work from home. There is a lot to be anxious about at present so does this post really help positive mental attitude being stuffed as it is with doom and gloom?

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), Dave5705 on 31/03/2020(UTC)
chris42  
#10 Posted : 19 March 2020 10:20:08(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

It was reported on the radio this morning that air pollution is down in large cities due to less traffic, so good for the environment. :0)

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
A Kurdziel  
#11 Posted : 19 March 2020 11:41:19(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

My question is: what is the exit strategy?

Governments have been criticised in the past for engaging in wars, with no clear final objective. As a result they end up starting something and then arbitrarily deciding they have done enough and it for leaving others to pick up the pieces in lives lost etc.

We seem to be moving in the same direction of travel here. Covid 19 will not raise the white flag when it is done, there will be no Instrument of Surrender signed and I can’t see us celebrating a VC (Victory against Corona) day any time soon.

Even if the number of new infections starts to fall as there is no community immunity, if we start to lift the restrictions, there will be a surge in new cases. So how long do we keep this lockdown going?  How long can we sustain it with half the workforce sent home?

People will suffer as a result of these restrictions. It will damage their mental as well as their physical and financial health. It will take a long time for the world to recover from the trauma.

Will people ask the question was it worth all of this suffering for what is basically a new strain of cold?

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RayRapp on 19/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), Dave5705 on 31/03/2020(UTC)
CptBeaky  
#12 Posted : 19 March 2020 11:53:35(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

The irony is that we will never know if it was worth the effort. Either the controls work and we all wonder what the fuss was about, or they don't and we all blmae the governments for not doing enough. A bit like H&S in general...

As for good news, cases are falling in the countries first affected. Pollution levels are at their lowest for decades. We have dolphins returning the Venice. People can finally move on from consumerism and understand that a walk in the woods is a wonderful thing. Cleaners can finally have their day. Families will realise that they can spend time together. Working from home will start becoming the norm. Un-necessary plane journeys will start being frowned upon. And we all get together and sing Kumbaya.

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Hodgkinson42218 on 19/03/2020(UTC), kmason83 on 19/03/2020(UTC), nic168 on 19/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), maryam_haider on 23/03/2020(UTC)
Hodgkinson42218  
#13 Posted : 19 March 2020 12:10:27(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Hodgkinson42218

I really hope we change our way of working after this too.  The number of pointless journeys that are made for a 1 hour face to face meeting.  For the environment and worklife balance we could get something good out of this.

Here's hoping

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), maryam_haider on 23/03/2020(UTC), Dave5705 on 31/03/2020(UTC)
chris42  
#14 Posted : 19 March 2020 12:13:39(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

Originally Posted by: A Kurdziel Go to Quoted Post

My question is: what is the exit strategy?

Well you have to assume the current people that have died, made it as far as the hospital and the NHS was unable to help them. The government commented that they hoped to keep the number of deaths down to 20,000. They said at one point 1 in 5 will get it, but you can isolate all you want I can’t see how you will not get it; food has to be delivered by someone.

So effectively all those that are going to die will and the rest will have an immunity built up as they have had it once. This isolation business is just about delaying it not stopping it, in order to help our NHS service, save some but not all. Then life will go on. They are suggesting this virus will not just go away at some point it will be with us for years, so will all these special measures still be in place next year and the year after etc. We will hopefully have a vaccine by then, but it could also mutate.

Perhaps home working where possible should continue indefinitely, roads quieter, less pollution more time in bed everyone’s a winner.

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aud on 19/03/2020(UTC), RayRapp on 19/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
kmason83  
#15 Posted : 19 March 2020 12:14:19(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
kmason83

Originally Posted by: CptBeaky Go to Quoted Post

The irony is that we will never know if it was worth the effort. Either the controls work and we all wonder what the fuss was about, or they don't and we all blmae the governments for not doing enough. A bit like H&S in general...

As for good news, cases are falling in the countries first affected. Pollution levels are at their lowest for decades. We have dolphins returning the Venice. People can finally move on from consumerism and understand that a walk in the woods is a wonderful thing. Cleaners can finally have their day. Families will realise that they can spend time together. Working from home will start becoming the norm. Un-necessary plane journeys will start being frowned upon. And we all get together and sing Kumbaya.

Amen to all of  that dude! :) 

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
A Kurdziel  
#16 Posted : 19 March 2020 12:25:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

Originally Posted by: CptBeaky Go to Quoted Post

The irony is that we will never know if it was worth the effort. Either the controls work and we all wonder what the fuss was about, or they don't and we all blmae the governments for not doing enough. A bit like H&S in general...

As for good news, cases are falling in the countries first affected. Pollution levels are at their lowest for decades. We have dolphins returning the Venice. People can finally move on from consumerism and understand that a walk in the woods is a wonderful thing. Cleaners can finally have their day. Families will realise that they can spend time together. Working from home will start becoming the norm. Un-necessary plane journeys will start being frowned upon. And we all get together and sing Kumbaya.

I suppose someone has to be an optimist!

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#17 Posted : 19 March 2020 13:02:45(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Come by car? Shouldn't that be "We'll meet again" ala Dr Strangelove (as the cataclysm unfolded on screen).

This home working does mean I am not present to be a victim of our random D&A testing, nor required to drive, so if you wouldn't mind and "Pass the dutchie"

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CptBeaky on 19/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), Dave5705 on 31/03/2020(UTC)
RayRapp  
#18 Posted : 19 March 2020 14:54:21(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

I have been reading about the so-called 'Spanish flu during the First World War. This influenza outbreak was a sub-type of H1N1, which was associated with Swine Flu in 2009. Spanish flu infected an estimated 500 million people, about 27% of the world's population and resulted in a death toll of 17 -100 million people.

Interestingly the virus did not eminate from Spain. Rather, due to censorship of reporting by countries involved in WWI it did not affect Spain, because they were neutral and not involved in the war. Some historians believe Spanish flu eminated from China, as is the case with the Black Death (Bubonic Plague) of the Middle Ages, which wiped out an estimated 30-60% of Europe's population at the time. There is a common dominator here it seems.        

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webstar on 19/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#19 Posted : 19 March 2020 15:38:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

So "Flu" Man Chu we meet again....

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
A Kurdziel  
#20 Posted : 19 March 2020 16:12:29(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

The last “proper” flu pandemic (Category 2) was Hong Kong Flu, in 1968. It started in the Far East and was spread to the US by troops returning from Vietnam. According to the CDC in the US it killed an estimated 1 million worldwide people and about 100,000 in the United States. Most excess deaths were in people 65 years and older. Sounds familiar?  

The thing was I don’t remember anything like the precautions being taken now being applied. In 1968 people were either rioting or dropping out man. Why are we being so uncool now, yer dig?

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
stevedm  
#21 Posted : 20 March 2020 07:44:46(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stevedm

....10 years ago we talked about these scenarios at the EPC College when we were planning for Avaian Flu, SARS and then again for MERS...this is an absolute triumph for emergency planning/ planners.... :)

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
RVThompson  
#22 Posted : 20 March 2020 07:50:37(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
RVThompson

My thoughts on this; it was pre-smartphone/internet/unsocial-media days.

I don't remember this level of reporting/scrutiny for SARS or MERS.

Undoubtedly national health services around the world are under severe pressure, but irresponsible journalism and 'social influencing' is not helping at all.

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A Kurdziel on 20/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), nic168 on 20/03/2020(UTC), Dave5705 on 31/03/2020(UTC)
Kim Hedges  
#23 Posted : 20 March 2020 11:05:50(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kim Hedges

Here we are on Friday morning 20/3/20.  I watched the midnight news last night on the BBC, some C19 figures from around the world. 

144 Dead in the UK and 3269 cases, (so computer model figures from the London School of Economics would predict 144,000 cases). 

11,000 cases in America and 150 dead and today California has ordered a 'stay at home', the USA seems to have 3 clusters so far, Washington State, California and New York.

3400 dead in Italy, (more than China now).  The dead have since been moved by Italian Military convoys to mortuaries around the country.  

1300 cases in Iran and 149 dead.

600 cases in Australia and 6 dead and they have just closed their borders until further notice (UFN).

15,000 cases in Germany and 44 dead. 

 Meanwhile madness in Japan as they still expect the Olymics to start in July - needs to be postponed for 2 or 3 years (yes years).    

I like many I'm sure, waited patiently for the UK Government press conference on Thursday. First off PM, you were late and no apology for being late. Then after the speech had finished and the questions from the press followed - we are all left thinking what a waste of time! Nothing was actually said, no decisive action - again. And again, no official ban order, so the police are powerless to act on mass gatherings. Nothing said about the 20k troops put on readiness, plus why only 20k, we need all the armed forces, as only 6000 can actually be on duty at a time (they need to sleep too and this will be going on for months). Why haven't our armed forces been recalled to the UK? For 2 days now, we've been aware of stranded people in Peru, why hasn't the RAF done any repatriation flights, I presume it's because the PM hasn't ordered it, wtf not? Why is the UK Embassy in Peru shut as reports suggest, just when it's needed? We need less wishy washy direction from our leadership.

Now today, Friday, the UK Government has asked for those 65,000 ex-NHS people whose jobs were cut over the past 10 years and assisted in retiring (often early) are now being asked to come back and work for the NHS.  Am I alone in thinking these people - if they do return - should be paid far more? 

The idea of 'doing your bit' is insulting to say the least. 

chris42  
#24 Posted : 20 March 2020 11:52:57(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

Working from home for first day. I’ve just had the postman put mail through the door. Except it wasn’t mail it was Junk, all of it, not real mail at all! Now I think the postman had gloves on, but he of course touched 100s / 1000s of gates and doors etc. Plus, this junk mail will have been touched by god knows who before delivery. These were my thoughts as I was holding this stuff in my hands by the door. One infected person has touched their gate, and then spread to rest of community by this unnecessary activity.

Now in shops I have watched people picking up stuff and putting it back on the self when they decide against, and want to say “don’t touch unless your going to buy it” “look with your eyes not hands”. One chap mauled every bag of oranges in the tray.

Ok your food containers will have been touched by many, and does not pay to get to paranoid. However, no need to add to it or unnecessary activities.

Does anyone know how long this virus can survive on surfaces?

Chris

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
Hsquared14  
#25 Posted : 20 March 2020 12:31:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Hsquared14

This is a purely personal post - I am stressed to breaking point!!  For several reasons:

  • People are looking to me to give them answers to questions that no one has answers to - I'm flattered folks but I can only read the same material as you can
  • I have leukaemia - I'm at ultra high risk, everytime I hear someone cough I fear for my life.  If I catch it then there is a good chance it will kill me!!
  • Government guidance on Social Distancing says if you have leukaemia you need to practice Social Shielding from the weekend but we aren't going to tell you what that means until the middle of week commencing 23/03 so WTF am I supposed to be doing - I'm taking a week's holiday next week to give myself a breather
  • Because my GP has been shut I've been unable to get a prescription for blood pressure meds - if the virus doesn't kill me a stroke or heartattack will!!!

This is seriously going to affect mental health as much as it affects physical health - a critical care nurse has just been on the radio and she can't get basic foods like fruit and vegetables, I want to cry but I can't!!  This is showing us all a very mean, selfish and unattractive side of the general public but on the flip side a very caring side of doctors, nurses and other key people in society.  I do fear though for people like me who will be very vulnerable and could slip through the net if they can't get hold of basic food stuffs.

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CptBeaky on 20/03/2020(UTC), Andy Cressy on 20/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), bxuxa on 22/03/2020(UTC), silberfee on 23/03/2020(UTC), peter gotch on 27/03/2020(UTC), Dave5705 on 31/03/2020(UTC)
nic168  
#26 Posted : 20 March 2020 12:45:01(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
nic168

Hsquared, sorry to hear this is getting you so stressed- I offer a socially distanced shrug of sympathy.

Seriously, you ask about survival of the virus on surface, there was something on NHS about this, I believ it can survive for up to 72 hours on hard surfaces and 3 on fabrics/soft surfaces. Not sure if this helps, tbh it worries me that the survival rate is so unpredicatable.

The Mental Health side of this is a big concern for those who are isolated, social media does not appeal to everyone and not all of us want to watch live feed of animals in zoos;

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chris42 on 20/03/2020(UTC), Andy Cressy on 20/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
grim72  
#27 Posted : 20 March 2020 12:51:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
grim72

My company has designed a small range of signs that you can download and print off for free for anyone in self-isolation to stick on their door/window. You can access them at the top of our Facebook page if you want to use them or forward to any friends/family or colleagues. Hope I'm ok to post this here (I wouldnt usually)

https://www.facebook.com/goodtogosafety/

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
CptBeaky  
#28 Posted : 20 March 2020 13:13:32(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

Originally Posted by: Hsquared14 Go to Quoted Post
  • People are looking to me to give them answers to questions that no one has answers to - I'm flattered folks but I can only read the same material as you can

I understand this too well. Apparantly I now have to be an expert in employment law, governmental decision making and pathology. I spend most of my day being shouted at by frightened people that a scared for the health of themselves and their loved ones, whilst balancing this with the need to stay economically stable.

Meanwhile we can't get hold of many of the supplies needed to keep our company running. How do people think the healthcare workers, supermarkets etc get supplied, if not by the manufacturing sector. By all means big up those in the NHS, but don't forget that the manufacturing sector has been woefully unfunded by successive governments for decades. If we stop the country stops....

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), nic168 on 23/03/2020(UTC), silberfee on 23/03/2020(UTC)
chris42  
#29 Posted : 20 March 2020 13:16:56(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

Hsquared14

I’m able to take a repeat prescription to my local chemist, who then take it to the doctors then prep my prescription for 5 to 7 days’ time. I can post it through the letter box and then just collect. You may be aware of this, sorry if so and no good for you. Otherwise worth a try. They may have access to doctors somewhere that can sign off a repeat prescription if not your local doctor.

Tell others you don’t know the answer and if they find out before you, let you know, then walk away. However, sounds like you need to go home and stay there.

Non crying - tricky one, I would suggest cutting an onion, but that depends if you can get one :0)  (ok my poor attempt at humour).

People are selfish, no way past it, but those same hoarders are capable of great kindness at the same time. In a way I don’t blame them as Gov advice is be prepared to not go out for two weeks, so that is what they are doing by stock piling food for a whole family for at least 2 weeks.

The world is a mad place accept it and move on.

Above all look after yourself, and take care.

Chris

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
Holliday42333  
#30 Posted : 20 March 2020 13:30:22(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Holliday42333

Originally Posted by: CptBeaky Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Hsquared14 Go to Quoted Post
  • People are looking to me to give them answers to questions that no one has answers to - I'm flattered folks but I can only read the same material as you can

I understand this too well. Apparantly I now have to be an expert in employment law, governmental decision making and pathology. I spend most of my day being shouted at by frightened people that a scared for the health of themselves and their loved ones, whilst balancing this with the need to stay economically stable.

Absolutely not trivialising the abuse issues, but should we have our own equivalent to #metoo?  I'm in the same boat, exactly.

When the UK Chief Medical Officer (who just happens to have pandemics as one of his specialisms) and the UK Chief Scientific Advisor are saying they don't have the answers, I am at a bit of a loss as to why people may think I have.  I am desperately trying to tell myself it is an acknowlegement of my skills and knowledge but it is definately a strain.

Hsquared; hope you get your meds sorted.  Hang in there!

thanks 3 users thanked Holliday42333 for this useful post.
CptBeaky on 20/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), silberfee on 23/03/2020(UTC)
A Kurdziel  
#31 Posted : 20 March 2020 13:32:10(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

Ah my bug bear people wearing gloves!

Why if your post man was wearing gloves all it does it the virus further unless he/she changes their gloves at every address they visit. You don’t need to wear gloves to protect you from the virus as it is a respiratory versus and can only infected you through your respiratory tract, not through the skin (it’s not Ebola). In theory the postie should be disinfecting their hands between addresses  and not touching their faces.

  

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
Andy Cressy  
#32 Posted : 20 March 2020 13:40:38(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Andy Cressy

The biggest issue is the fear of being unable to control what is or will happen. I like many more on this forum am being asked questions I dont have answers for. Its difficult not to get drawn into constant news watching or threads on social media.

I am trying to speak to colleagues as much as possible to reassure where i can and share the strain. The next few days/weeks will undoubtable test us.

Hope everbody has a safe weekend.

thanks 2 users thanked Andy Cressy for this useful post.
Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC), CptBeaky on 23/03/2020(UTC)
Hsquared14  
#33 Posted : 20 March 2020 14:00:50(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Hsquared14

Thank you Chris42 - can't wait until 3:30 when I can walk away for a while and let some of it at least go over my head!!

I just wish I knew what this Shielding thing is supposed to be - am I really supposed to be at home (no laptops available for me to work on so boredome awaits) for at least 12 weeks?

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Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
A Kurdziel  
#34 Posted : 20 March 2020 14:28:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

 I think that as we go into this lock down stay home pause, the main issue will not (the vast majority) be the virus but metal stress: when will it end, will I have job to go back to, will my money run out, and how will I cope living with my family 24/7 or conversely how will I cope with the isolation?

We know the issues but we cannot offer anything resembling an answer. I think that we have to be realistic and make it clear that we might sympathise but we can’t do very much else. We are essentially in the same boat as everybody else.

thanks 2 users thanked A Kurdziel for this useful post.
Andy Cressy on 20/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 20/03/2020(UTC)
Kim Hedges  
#35 Posted : 20 March 2020 15:22:12(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kim Hedges

I watched an interesting news package about the NHS staff coming back.  A Doctor, is willing to come back, but he pointed out a few short-comings.  He, like most Doctors have not held their BMA licence since leaving the NHS. 

Insurance at different levels needs to be put in place before work commences beacause as it was pointed out, an insurance claim against an uninsured doctor could mean losing their house and property to cover the subsequent claim. 

Training, for a Nurse to return to work, it is normally assumed they will need 3 months work up, to get to the correct standard and different parts of medicine requires further training. 

Training to use Ventilators is even harder and longer. 

PPE is still in short supply for the existing staff. 

These Ventilators are very special pieces of medical equipment that are more complicated than I had believed and it's not just a case of hooking up a patient like say connecting an IV.  Patients who need to be put on a ventilator need to be aneathstised first with a paralysing agent.  Then constantly monitored.  Patients on ventilators will occupy a bed for 16 days approximately.  During that time various other IV's and lines into their bodies needs to be monitored and managed.  Experience from Italy shows typical modern I.C.U. rooms with extra beds side to side, without much space, rather than one or two beds as normal.  The medical staff are obviously fried from the stress. 

It's apparent from other picturers doing the rounds that Hospital Managers, need to make emergency provision for semi-permanent dormitories for the doctors and nursing staff on the wards - URGENTLY.  

Appologies for the spelling mistakes. 

I too could be considered at risk, being 61 and a life long asthma sufferer, but I am not going to self isolate if a job contract suddenly appears, it's pretty unlikely at the moment and contracts mostly stopped over the winter season, so I've been stuck at home for the last 6 months anyway.  Brexit woes have really affected work.  I can't work from home as my work is currently that of a crane slinger.  

In another interesting article I read, that described the 1918 flu pandemic, they didn't have antibiotics then, we do now, but antibiotics are ineffective against the virus animal.  So the medical evidence is still valid to current treatment.  Fresh air and sunlight seems to have worked better than was expected.  The medical reasoning was the sunlight contained UV which is a natural disinfectant combined with fresh air prevents the virus from sticking to patients and surfaces compared to a still environment in a hospital ward.  This is why older hospital designs had high ceilings and large windows that opened to the fesh air - completely opposite to modern designs.   

RayRapp  
#36 Posted : 20 March 2020 19:38:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

Thought I would check to see what's happening in China, not heard anything lately. I was amazaed how many countries have at least one case, basically nearly every country in the world. Anyway, I found the information below which I believe is genuine and it appears China is making a good recovery from the disease. The second column is new cases and the fourth column is new deaths. Maybe some light at end of the long tunnel.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

China80,967+393,248 +371,1506,5692,13656Italy47,021+5,9864,032 +6275,12937,8602,655778
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Kim Hedges on 21/03/2020(UTC)
vincehoward  
#37 Posted : 21 March 2020 07:38:29(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
vincehoward

Originally Posted by: Kim Hedges Go to Quoted Post
Many Contractors in contracts at the moment, maybe losing their jobs shortly,

I'm a self employed H&S advisor and my work has virtually stopped completely. At a time when you are needed the most the first thing they have dispensed with is thier safety advisor?! Guess i'll be driving a Sainsbury's delivery lorry soon? (other Supermarkets are available!!)

thanks 2 users thanked vincehoward for this useful post.
Kim Hedges on 21/03/2020(UTC), bxuxa on 22/03/2020(UTC)
RayRapp  
#38 Posted : 21 March 2020 08:42:56(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

I can't see too many organisations employing people (except supermarkets) at this point in time. Oddly enough an agency phoned me a few of days ago asking if I was interested in a short-term role with a well known charity. They said the h&s person must have 'specialist knowledge of Covid-19 controls'. I responded I doubt if there are any h&s people with that specialist knowledge.  

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Kim Hedges on 21/03/2020(UTC)
Kim Hedges  
#39 Posted : 21 March 2020 12:00:12(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kim Hedges

Saturday 21/3/20.  A closure order of Pubs, Clubs, Restaurants, Theatres, Cinemas, Sport Centers and Gyms was put in place on Friday in the UK.  Enforcement through licensing (meaning if the licensed premises breaches the order, the license is refused when it comes up for renewal by the Police and Local Council).  A review will be conducted in a month by the Government.

The UK has had 167 deaths so far.

Meanwhile the confirmed cases of the C19 virus continues globally and the death rates are rising everywhere but China.

Northern Italy seems to be worst hit at the moment, with another 627 deaths reported in the last 24 hours and 4000 dead in total, whilst other parts of Italy have no cases.

Spain has 1000 deaths so far.

Germany has 16,662 reported cases and 47 dead so far.

France has 450 dead, 78 in the last 24 hours.

The African continent only has 1000 dead altogether.

The USA has 18,500 reported cases and 249 dead so far.

Australia has 1000 confirmed cases.  Bondi Beach has been closed in Sydney, after crowds ignored local bans.

Every country has had at least one person die from Covid19.

Ian Bell2  
#40 Posted : 21 March 2020 12:36:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell2

No need to repeat the statistics, we can all watch the tv news or other news media to get the data

thanks 2 users thanked Ian Bell2 for this useful post.
webstar on 23/03/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 23/03/2020(UTC)
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