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John Murray  
#401 Posted : 19 June 2020 11:33:14(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
John Murray

The ubiquitous "Big Red Button" no longer sends the "Nuke the B'stards" signal to the Joint Chiefs, it sends a signal to the local McD saying "send one big mac, extra ketchup and onions and none of that green stuff, with large coke and large fries"

Originally Posted by: biker1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: John Murray Go to Quoted Post

Just emailed him that intense radiation destroys the SARS-CoV-2 virus. Glad to be of help.

Oh no! I hope you also emailed his team to take the big red button off him immediately. If not, I'll follow previous government advice, and get under the dining room table (the one from Ikea, of course).
thanks 3 users thanked John Murray for this useful post.
biker1 on 19/06/2020(UTC), CptBeaky on 19/06/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 22/06/2020(UTC)
John Murray  
#402 Posted : 19 June 2020 11:40:20(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
John Murray

They've just gone-over to using the GOOGAPPLE app that others are using. After they finally got the message that their home-grown-and-expensively-bought app would not work with Apples iOS, and that Apple would not alter their OS to allow it to (they were told mid-May that the app would not work in the background and that it would consume much current in the foreground). Eton seems to not be in the foreground of IT education. Who knew?

Originally Posted by: biker1 Go to Quoted Post

Well, I see that people have flocked to the clothes and sports shops as soon as they opened, like sheep. Horrendous queues. I don't understand it - surely the only clothing many of us need to replace are our pyjamas. I thought the lines of cars for McDonalds was bad enough - I've never wanted a Big Mac that badly, and can't ever imagine doing so. Mind you, it does suggest an idea for a birthday present - a gift card for Primark, together with a new umbrella for queuing in the rain.

The track and trace system (our 'world beating' system) continues to be a farce, with a U-turn on the app. Is this government capable of doing anything right?

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biker1  
#403 Posted : 22 June 2020 09:37:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Well, it's been a bad week or so for Donald Trump. His poll ratings are sliding, two of his measures have been overturned by the courts, two books are in the pipeline about him, one by his niece, and his first rally in months has had a poor turnout (held in Tulsa, the scene of a massacre of 300 negroes, very tactful Mr Trump).

Thinking about these rallies, I just don't get it. At a time when the infection rate is increasing in nine states, he holds mass rallies where no-one is social distancing and most are not wearing any form of mask. I know we have had some illegal raves in this country, but to pack people into a stadium with the approval of the president beggars belief. He still seems to think the virus will magically disappear. He's been wanting to leave the White House for months, something I think we would all like to see on a permanent basis.

In this country, Boris is proving a bit of an embarrasment to his party, with rumblings in the ranks. He's in good company - the whole cabinet are an embarrasment.

Edited by user 22 June 2020 09:39:05(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Kim Hedges on 22/06/2020(UTC)
CptBeaky  
#404 Posted : 22 June 2020 09:56:58(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

Politicians are treating COVID-19 like me trying to gain a 6 pack.

Try really hard for a few months. Get bored and decide it is too much effort and 6 packs aren't real anyway.

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Kim Hedges on 22/06/2020(UTC)
Holliday42333  
#405 Posted : 22 June 2020 10:31:01(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Holliday42333

Has the UK tried REALLY hard though?

Now hindsight is beginning to kick in, it does appear that all the UK efforts have been a compromise (albeit it hasn't felt like that) to protect short term wealth as much as possible.

Compare to Australia / New Zealand.  Control borders ridgidly and early (to prevent importing cases), hard lockdowns (to control infection transmission) until the infection rate/cases is WAY down and institute robust contact tracing (to contain outbreaks).

Even accounting for the advantages their world location and population density gave them compared to the UK, whilst we are now caught in a long term controls, continuing infections and economic disaster our antipodean cousins are, other than border control, back to normal on a day to day basis.  Sure they have taken an ecconomic hit but I bet history will show the UKs is worst due to dragging the whole thing out in order to do the least possible whilst not being totally reckless.

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Kim Hedges on 22/06/2020(UTC)
Kate  
#406 Posted : 22 June 2020 10:37:24(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

 - CACNER - Cheapest Available Controls Not Entailing Riots

or possibly

- CACNEED - Cheapest Available Controls Not Entailing Electoral Disaster

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biker1  
#407 Posted : 22 June 2020 11:21:54(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Originally Posted by: Holliday42333 Go to Quoted Post

Has the UK tried REALLY hard though?

Now hindsight is beginning to kick in, it does appear that all the UK efforts have been a compromise (albeit it hasn't felt like that) to protect short term wealth as much as possible.

Compare to Australia / New Zealand.  Control borders ridgidly and early (to prevent importing cases), hard lockdowns (to control infection transmission) until the infection rate/cases is WAY down and institute robust contact tracing (to contain outbreaks).

Even accounting for the advantages their world location and population density gave them compared to the UK, whilst we are now caught in a long term controls, continuing infections and economic disaster our antipodean cousins are, other than border control, back to normal on a day to day basis.  Sure they have taken an ecconomic hit but I bet history will show the UKs is worst due to dragging the whole thing out in order to do the least possible whilst not being totally reckless.

Quite so, the UK's government have dithered and delayed at every step. Late into a limited 'lockdown', the scandal of the care home deaths, delays on testing, relying on a depleted police force to 'enforce' the lockdown without giving them adequate powers and not bringing in the army, rushing to kit out Nightingale hospitals and then barely using them, leaving the regular hospitals to take the load, with the inevitable loss of normal services, which is likely to lead to many more deaths, confusing and contradictory messages, a muppet of a PM who is clearly incompetent and a correspondingly disastrous cabinet, the ongoing farce of the track and trace system, easing lockdown too early, allowing illegal gatherings through a softly softly approach, breaches of lockdown by those who really should know better, including a senior advisor who seems to be in charge rather than the PM, lack of emergency planning that resulted in healthcare professionals wearing binbags for lack of PPE, with hundreds of them paying with their lives, and warnings and advice from experts ignored.

Incompetence doesn't even begin to describe it.

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Kim Hedges on 22/06/2020(UTC)
biker1  
#408 Posted : 23 June 2020 09:36:57(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Has anyone managed to actually see a GP during this COVID crisis? Appointments seem to be mostly on the phone these days, so presumably they have developed ESP to diagnose patients. We have the equipment to do temperature, blood pressure, sats, blood sugar, urine dip tests, check ears, so we have been doing the GPs' work for them for the last three months. Starting to wonder what we have GPs for. Considering the conditions that hospital doctors and nurses have been working under, the GPs come across as real snowflakes. I think when this is all over, there needs to be a reckoning over them. They have over the years managed to get out of out of hours cover, and there was a recent vote by their college on stopping home visits. The ambulance service is filling in for the lack of an efficient out of hours service and the reluctance to spend hours at A&E, which is not what they should be there for. We have had to attend hospital recently, and one after another coming in had been sent in by their GP, even one young girl with a sore throat. It is all getting a bit silly.

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Kim Hedges on 23/06/2020(UTC), Sam Ellacott on 24/06/2020(UTC)
Kim Hedges  
#409 Posted : 23 June 2020 11:38:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kim Hedges

I watched Fierce Creatures on Netflix a few days ago, Jamie Lee Curtis mentioned the word, Pronoid, to describe someone.  Pronoid is the opposite of paranoid. A paranoid person thinks, without any basis in reality, that everybody is out to get them. A pronoid person is someone who thinks, without any basis in reality, that everybody likes them.  Does this describe President Trump? 

Meanwhile on American news, I was educated on who President Andrew Jackson was.  I was not aware of his history, being a large slave owner and vehmently against the abolishionists against slavery.  His passing of the bill, to remove the native american's from their lands and send them on the Trail of Tears.  It really does make you wonder how a statue erected to him was allowed to be placed (and then left there) on the Whitehouse Lawn.  Totally sick, to allow that man to have a statue.  To me it's as sick a notion of allowing the Battle Flag to be used in Nascar.

The American Black Lives Matter ideology has spread worldwide, which to me is overdue.  The UK like America has laws and standards, both in the letter of the law and the spirit of the law, but inequalities still exist, for all the hype and spin from the corporate world. 

I like playing computer games in my spare time and currently play a game called Valnir Rok, which is an early release alpha state. on the Steam portal.  I also play occassionally World of Tanks, in years gone by, I've played Eveonline and many other games.  This week I had to make a stand against a game.  I bought a computer game on the Steam catalogue called Conan Exiles, which is very loosly based on the film Conan the Barbarian.  Just before I actually started to play it, the game notes on how to play the game gave explicit referernce to slavery, with non player characters (NPCs) who work as slaves to the player (they are called Thralls), who use the Wheel of Pain.  There was also reference to the harvesting of human flesh, so cannibalism.  I was shocked to read that in a modern computer game, so I complained to the Management Support Desk and posted a note on the game forum, basically saying I was amazed that the company condones slavery and cannabalism.  I was obviously flamed by the zealots, but the idea remains, why is it OK to allow specific reference to something that has been illegal for hundreds of years, even if it is in a game?  

Back in the real world, we in Britain have seen Covid 19 continue to ravage our the population.  42, 647 of our people have now died, 15 reported yesterday.  Greed and politics appear to be winning over social safety, as 20,000 people continue to be infected weekly and the weekly death rate is holding at 600 and certainly not going down. 

Brexit negotiations have stalled yet again, so we will probably be leaving on World Trade Oganisation rules - rather than anything this dopey Government dreams up.  

In theory, tomorrow, we will have 3 days of Summer, no doubt returning to cold and wet conditions shortly thereafter. 

If I get a cold, I will be going to my local pharmacy, Boots, in my recently pedestrianised High Street in Thornbury, as it's just not prudent to go into a place where you can catch Covid 19 like a doctors surgery. 

 

Edited by user 23 June 2020 11:45:58(UTC)  | Reason: Doctors note.

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biker1 on 23/06/2020(UTC)
biker1  
#410 Posted : 23 June 2020 12:10:29(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Well, the USA has had some real lulus for president over the years, which have included a serial womaniser who nearly started WW3, a stressed out peanut farmer, another womaniser and pathological liar, an idiot who didn't know much about anything, and now they have Trump, the Tango Terror.

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Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC)
John Murray  
#411 Posted : 23 June 2020 15:01:44(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
John Murray

GP?

I have one. I think. To get to see him/her/it, I first have to convince the admin staff that I am ill (bear in mind they are not trained diagnosticians). Then I have to have my temperature taken, by a masked bandit (bear in mind that many people can be infected by CV19 and have no symptoms). I then have to sit in a waiting area, consisting of chairs spaced far apart, reminisent of musical chairs game. My last review, immediately prior to the onset of global epidemic, changed one of  my ongoing meds to a lower dose, wrongly. It cannot be "righted" as it is not urgent enough for an appointment. My 3-monthly cancer review has now gone 6 months without review, and the next one will be by phone. Quite how an MRI is going to be done over the phone is a puzzle to me. My medication is delivered to me, free. Free to me, but expensive to the local CCG. And I have just received the missive from the govt that I am "allowed" out for a brief period of association, daily. To have a blood test, I have to wear a facemask. Following the last verbal altercation over this (I am exempt), I have acquired a full-face FFP3R "mask" which I will wear next visit (properly fitted, I have been trained)....bear in mind that I was being berated by a nurse for not wearing a mask, whilst the one she had on; only covered her mouth!

"Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right, here I am, Stuck in the middle [with you]"

Originally Posted by: Kim Hedges Go to Quoted Post

Back in the real world, we in Britain have seen Covid 19 continue to ravage our the population.  42, 647 of our people have now died, 15 reported yesterday.  Greed and politics appear to be winning over social safety, as 20,000 people continue to be infected weekly and the weekly death rate is holding at 600 and certainly not going down. 

Brexit negotiations have stalled yet again, so we will probably be leaving on World Trade Oganisation rules - rather than anything this dopey Government dreams up.  

In theory, tomorrow, we will have 3 days of Summer, no doubt returning to cold and wet conditions shortly thereafter. 

If I get a cold, I will be going to my local pharmacy, Boots, in my recently pedestrianised High Street in Thornbury, as it's just not prudent to go into a place where you can catch Covid 19 like a doctors surgery. 

 

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John Murray  
#412 Posted : 23 June 2020 15:07:22(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
John Murray

And just as an aside: Many GPs' have been assisting in hospitals, so some practices are undermanned/underpersonned. The two practice nurses in my GPs' were redeployed, also to the hospital. Many retired doctors/nurses have either been asked, or have voluntered, to go back to work. many of those have become ill, some have died.

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Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC), nic168 on 03/07/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#413 Posted : 23 June 2020 19:32:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

I managed to see my GP just before lock down at which point they increased the dose of my medication.

I now repeat on-line but the trouble is the "listed" prescription is the lower strength version, adding a comment to the order and for the last three months the pharmacy has always had the correct strength ready for collection.

Did try a month ago to see the GP which ended up in referal to the local walk-in Covid assessment centre.

Today having been screened by the admin staff which was followed up by a telephone consultation tomorrow I have an actual face to face appointment. Entered the National Lottery on-line!

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Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#414 Posted : 23 June 2020 19:32:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

I managed to see my GP just before lock down at which point they increased the dose of my medication.

I now repeat on-line but the trouble is the "listed" prescription is the lower strength version, adding a comment to the order and for the last three months the pharmacy has always had the correct strength ready for collection.

Did try a month ago to see the GP which ended up in referal to the local walk-in Covid assessment centre.

Today having been screened by the admin staff which was followed up by a telephone consultation tomorrow I have an actual face to face appointment. Entered the National Lottery on-line!

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC), Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC)
CptBeaky  
#415 Posted : 24 June 2020 07:56:19(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

And now Germany has an outbreak of over 1500 cases on a meat processing plant. I think this is the 3rd outbreak in Germany at meat processing plants, a trend that has occured across the globe, including Wales, the USA and other countries.

But you all know my stance on this, so I will move on...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZ2YVvXL7Hk (BBC News story on why outbreaks occur in meat processing plants)

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Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC)
biker1  
#416 Posted : 24 June 2020 08:11:03(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Originally Posted by: CptBeaky Go to Quoted Post

And now Germany has an outbreak of over 1500 cases on a meat processing plant. I think this is the 3rd outbreak in Germany at meat processing plants, a trend that has occured across the globe, including Wales, the USA and other countries.

But you all know my stance on this, so I will move on...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZ2YVvXL7Hk (BBC News story on why outbreaks occur in meat processing plants)

Interesting. Is there any evidence that the infections have occurred because of what they are processing, or more likely from workers' close proximity to each other? I think the points raised about infections from animals, especially in view of the conditions many are kept in, are well made. Definitely a subject worthy of investigation.
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Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC)
CptBeaky  
#417 Posted : 24 June 2020 08:30:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

The conditions in meat processing plants allow viruses to remain viable for extremely long times. Basically they become huge reservoirs, storing up all sorts of disease. Normally this isn't a problem as these are not transmittable to humans, it is only when something like this shows up.

This combined with many other factors such as :

  • They tend to be noisy, so people shout
  • People tend to work closer together
  • They tend to employ migrant workers, that are worried about complaining
  • They often have nearby accomodation, meaning the workforce mix more
  • They are phsyical jobs, people breath heavier
  • No daylight, so the virus does get killed by UV light

In the past we have seen other outbreaks happening in thes places. Whilst all factories have many of the above issues, it is the combination along with the damp surroundings that make them a perfect storm. Basically animal agriculture starts these diseases, and then exacerbates them when they do spread.

Read about Smithfield in the US for a good look at the problem, combined with some shockingly bad safety. Always good to see the wrong way to do something.

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CptBeaky  
#418 Posted : 24 June 2020 08:42:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

https://www.wired.com/story/why-meatpacking-plants-have-become-covid-19-hot-spots/

Is a really good read, It also mentions the ventilation and cold temperature, which also contribute to the spread of influenzia (which may also be the routes that SARS-COV-2 spread, although more research is needed)

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Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC)
biker1  
#419 Posted : 24 June 2020 09:46:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

I read about the Smithfield plant a while ago, horrendous personal accounts of how workers were treated. A situation that was out of control. Cultural factors certainly relevant, such as migrant workers too afraid to raise concerns, and risk losing their livelihoods, working conditions, lack of health and safety enforcement (a consistent feature in the USA), and of course Trump 'ordering' meat processors to work. The potential for transmission of disease to humans is a key concern given the farming and slaughtering methods now used.

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Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC)
Kim Hedges  
#420 Posted : 24 June 2020 13:03:22(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kim Hedges

I was more than a bit miffed by the Prime Minister yesterday during the 5 O'clock press breifing, saying no more updates from tomorrow!

The UK has 20,000 new cases of infection every week at the moment. 

There has been a slow decline in deaths, but the weekly amount is still about 600. 

We are not through this pandemic, removing the press briefings is wrong. 

biker1  
#421 Posted : 24 June 2020 14:49:10(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Well he does come across as a lazy sod, or perhaps he wants to do some sabre rattling with the EU.

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Kim Hedges on 24/06/2020(UTC)
biker1  
#422 Posted : 28 June 2020 18:06:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

What is wrong with our young people? Block parties, street parties, raves, attacking the police who are trying to protect society from their stupidity, packing beaches, leaving disgusting litter all over the place. They seem to have no self-control, no respect for others. They want to party, and screw everyone else. It's not just a tiny minority, but thousands engaging in this behaviour. This is not a valid protest movement about anything in particular, it's just young people being complete d***heads. What sort of generation has this country raised?

The only way this is going to be controlled is doing what should have been done a couple of months ago - bring in the army, but we have a government that is too weak and dithering to do so. We are justified in going to war with other countries trying to kill us; the only difference here is that the enemy is amongst us.

Roundtuit  
#423 Posted : 28 June 2020 19:40:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Welcome to the world that SM left wing ideology delivers. A right of entitlement without consequence or respect for what delivered such freedoms. The army unfortunately is not the answer as the controlling mind will sway and bend to the marches and petitions proliferated through the internet.
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Sharpe23621 on 29/06/2020(UTC), Sharpe23621 on 29/06/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#424 Posted : 28 June 2020 19:40:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Welcome to the world that SM left wing ideology delivers. A right of entitlement without consequence or respect for what delivered such freedoms. The army unfortunately is not the answer as the controlling mind will sway and bend to the marches and petitions proliferated through the internet.
thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Sharpe23621 on 29/06/2020(UTC), Sharpe23621 on 29/06/2020(UTC)
Mark-W  
#425 Posted : 29 June 2020 14:44:22(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Mark-W

Originally Posted by: Roundtuit Go to Quoted Post
Welcome to the world that SM left wing ideology delivers. A right of entitlement without consequence or respect for what delivered such freedoms. The army unfortunately is not the answer as the controlling mind will sway and bend to the marches and petitions proliferated through the internet.

Agree the Army is not the way ahead, we don't want to become a military policed state, plus soldiers are currently being prosecuted for doing their job over 40 yrs ago. All based on spurious diary entries and statements given a couple of years ago. I couldn't give an accurate statement about my days on the streets of NI and that was only 20 yrs ago, let alone 40 yrs ago.

Plus there would be a black and white solution, the Army wouldn't be given the leeway to make judgement calls without being over scrutinised and critisized at every turn

Plus if the Army are on the streets doing the job of the Police, who is going to empty the bins, drive fire engines, rebuild flood damaged bridges and the list goes on.

Edited by user 29 June 2020 14:45:11(UTC)  | Reason: Rubbish speeling

Roundtuit  
#426 Posted : 29 June 2020 19:39:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

If the cases in Leicester are rising warranting a "local lockdown" what real difference will delaying business opening have - surely there needs to be some roll back in the recently relaxed rules as well?

Well it appears as of 22:00 Hrs non-essential shops will close from Tuesday and schools from Thursday - stable doors and horses Mr Hancock?

Also could someone please define what is "non-essential" travel? In Italy the carabinieri placed road blocks on locked down areas whereas in the UK we have many people of late demonstrating through their raves and marches that simple requests and written regulations do not work.

Edited by user 29 June 2020 21:31:31(UTC)  | Reason: updated

Roundtuit  
#427 Posted : 29 June 2020 19:39:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

If the cases in Leicester are rising warranting a "local lockdown" what real difference will delaying business opening have - surely there needs to be some roll back in the recently relaxed rules as well?

Well it appears as of 22:00 Hrs non-essential shops will close from Tuesday and schools from Thursday - stable doors and horses Mr Hancock?

Also could someone please define what is "non-essential" travel? In Italy the carabinieri placed road blocks on locked down areas whereas in the UK we have many people of late demonstrating through their raves and marches that simple requests and written regulations do not work.

Edited by user 29 June 2020 21:31:31(UTC)  | Reason: updated

CptBeaky  
#428 Posted : 30 June 2020 09:20:46(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

We are based in a town within 20 miles of Leicester. The nearby factories bring mini buses from Leicester to work in those factories (meat processing plants again....) as Leicester has a high migrant population. Also we now expect people to travel to our town to shop, go to a pub etc.

I question how a local lockdown will help contain the virus, as opposed to just spreading it to the nearby towns and villages.

biker1  
#429 Posted : 30 June 2020 12:48:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

If the military is not the answer, someone please tell me what is. We have a serious public disorder problem here, and the police are really struggling to control it. They need some help, which they are not getting from our waffling and dithering government. This situation would simply not be tolerated in other countries. When you consider our position on the global league table of infections and deaths, the behaviour of so many people is just ridiculous and unacceptable. It would be a serious concern at the best of time; at the moment it represents a threat to the rest of the population who have complied with restrictions, and an insult to the thousands who have died, and those working all hours to try and save them.

A Kurdziel  
#430 Posted : 30 June 2020 13:30:48(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

I do worry about people that seem to think that the military are the solution to any crisis. The military have a role to play in society but is basically it’s down to fighting wars (hopefully in far off palaces) they have no particular skill or ability to solve our problems here and know. We can’t bomb Covid 19 into submission. In the old days the military was in effect a reserve of man power sitting around waiting for a war that didn’t happen (thank God) amateurs to deal with crisis you could call on them. Now the military has shrunk. There are just about 150 000 regulars, across the Army, RAF and Navy.  A significant chunk are either on operations or getting ready to go on operations. When they go on operations they rely heavily on reservists to support them. Effectively during operations its NHS staff that support the military not the other way around.

When they had the foot and mouth outbreak it was originally dealt with by staff from MAFF (as it then was) and other parts of the Civil Service. The government then, as sop to the Daily Wail etc brought the army in. The commanding officers, saw maintaining their operational capabilities was their no. 1 priority and the first thing they did was arranging for all of the civil servants to be chucked out of their nice hotels and moved into B’n’Bs so that they and their people had the best billets.

What we need is proper planning by people who know what they are doing. Simply saying call in the army is not really a solution.

biker1  
#431 Posted : 30 June 2020 14:53:06(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Any crisis? No, what we have had is the worst crisis in terms of threat to life for decades, arguably the worst since the flu pandemic of 1918. The army is not the answer for most of society's ills, but when we have a depleted police force, people breaking a strict 'lockdown', a dithering government instigating wishy washy legislation, and now what appears to be a complete free for all, I think that perhaps they may have an important role in maintaining order and protecting society against the idiots within it. I understand that we have something in the order of 20,000 troops available, although I'm sure you will correct me on this, who could help out here. The military has been invoked in other countries to control public behaviour, which has no doubt helped these other countries to tackle the crisis far better than we have. It would be a temporary measure, but one that the public disorder now rampant would suggest is needed.

Better planning? Yes, without a doubt, but we didn't get that, and so it is what it is now.

John Murray  
#432 Posted : 30 June 2020 16:18:07(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
John Murray

Why would you want troops on the streets?

Are there not enough infected people around, without exposing troops to the same?

Maybe you expect them to "sort-out" those ignoring the "rules" (given that most politicians quietly, and not so quietly, have been doing the same). Believe me, things are bad enough on the streets without army V people..... (and they were not a success in NI either)

aud  
#433 Posted : 30 June 2020 21:08:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
aud

As yet there is no specific regulations applicable to the local restrictions (not a lockdown, and certainly not strict) in Leicester. Likelihood is they will be similar to the original (English) which list specific shops and businesses, schools etc. which MUST close (eforced by local authority) and then had a limited list of reasons allowing people out of their home. That is the only regulated aspect, and is vague and fairly unenforceable - if you have a 'reasonable reason' for leaving the house, you can more or less go anywhere / do anything once you are out. Durham and eyesight tests for example. If that is 'wishy washy' so be it, but that's the way it is in this country. We are not a police state or under a military junta. 

Without specific  emergency powers legislation, the UK military cannot be utilised to enforce anything, not even stop traffic on our highways. They are untrained for police work. Some have indeed been assisting with the Covid testing sites, and helping to fit-out (not actually build) emergency hospitals, acting as extra hands, not in a law enforcement role. 

I am not seeing rampant public disorder, even on the Daily Mail website. There have been protests, and crowds at the seaside on a hot holiday, not my idea of an imminent breakdown in society requiring military intervention. 

CptBeaky  
#434 Posted : 01 July 2020 09:09:48(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

One of our employees returned from furlough on Monday (along with the last 30% that were still on furlough). They had the audacity to bring in some bournemouth rock that they had gotten on their visit the previous week. So I have people ranting at me that this person should not be allowed to return to work, especially since they work on a line with an 80 year old person (relatively, probably about 5m away. All our workers are at least 2m away from each other).

I have to explain to these concerned people that I have no control of what anybody does outside of work hours/premises. They haven't broken any law, and that they are just a ****. This is what happens when rules are wishy washy and vague. People will always try to push the limits, and in this case there are no boundaries.

Do I wish I could tell them to quarantine for 14 days before returning to work, on no pay, since it was their own selfish, stupidity that got them into this situation? Yes! Can I? No!

Roundtuit  
#435 Posted : 01 July 2020 09:34:04(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Absolutely not the company placed them on furlough i.e. not currently required for work.

Where they do this is their affair.

Just because they have rock from a location you have jumped to a conclusion they breached any guidance on social distancing or rules reagrding wearing face coverings in enclosed spaces (we know you are not based in Scotland or Wales where travel distances do form part of the rules).

It was only ever the severly clinically at risk self isolating who were guided not to venture out of their home.

How many of the indignant involved themselves in the various marches, protests, raves, street parties, house parties reported during the last 101 days and are keeping their mouths shut?

Roundtuit  
#436 Posted : 01 July 2020 09:34:04(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Absolutely not the company placed them on furlough i.e. not currently required for work.

Where they do this is their affair.

Just because they have rock from a location you have jumped to a conclusion they breached any guidance on social distancing or rules reagrding wearing face coverings in enclosed spaces (we know you are not based in Scotland or Wales where travel distances do form part of the rules).

It was only ever the severly clinically at risk self isolating who were guided not to venture out of their home.

How many of the indignant involved themselves in the various marches, protests, raves, street parties, house parties reported during the last 101 days and are keeping their mouths shut?

CptBeaky  
#437 Posted : 01 July 2020 09:39:54(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

To be fair, they even posted photos of themself at the beach on the day in question. So I think it is fair to say they were there

Roundtuit  
#438 Posted : 01 July 2020 10:06:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Didn't dispute the travel merely the assumption they had not followed HM guidance

Roundtuit  
#439 Posted : 01 July 2020 10:06:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Didn't dispute the travel merely the assumption they had not followed HM guidance

CptBeaky  
#440 Posted : 01 July 2020 10:13:35(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

The photos made it very clear they were not social distancing. I have not jumped to any conclusions, the social media account have shown the offending person holding BBQ parties throughout the lockdown, from day 1. They have shown countless breaches of the guidelines.

This is beside the point. The point is that even when we know that we have employees flaunting the rules outside of work, there is absolutely nothing we can do about it. It only takes one idiot to infect an entire workplace. Unfortunately being a selfish, idiot is not reasonable grounds to suspend someone. 

thanks 2 users thanked CptBeaky for this useful post.
Connor35037 on 01/07/2020(UTC), nic168 on 03/07/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#441 Posted : 01 July 2020 10:21:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

If your Social Media policy contains a line about bringing the company in to disrepute?

They placed the information in the public domain.

Wouldn't be the first person terminated for an on-line faux-pas and certainley won't be the last.

Roundtuit  
#442 Posted : 01 July 2020 10:21:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

If your Social Media policy contains a line about bringing the company in to disrepute?

They placed the information in the public domain.

Wouldn't be the first person terminated for an on-line faux-pas and certainley won't be the last.

stevedm  
#443 Posted : 01 July 2020 11:06:31(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stevedm

Originally Posted by: CptBeaky Go to Quoted Post

One of our employees returned from furlough on Monday (along with the last 30% that were still on furlough). They had the audacity to bring in some bournemouth rock that they had gotten on their visit the previous week. So I have people ranting at me that this person should not be allowed to return to work, especially since they work on a line with an 80 year old person (relatively, probably about 5m away. All our workers are at least 2m away from each other).

I have to explain to these concerned people that I have no control of what anybody does outside of work hours/premises. They haven't broken any law, and that they are just a ****. This is what happens when rules are wishy washy and vague. People will always try to push the limits, and in this case there are no boundaries.

Do I wish I could tell them to quarantine for 14 days before returning to work, on no pay, since it was their own selfish, stupidity that got them into this situation? Yes! Can I? No!

You need to find out the exact date they went and ensure that it is 14 days from the event and that they are not showing any symptoms...and the answer is yes you can...although if you haven't got a back to work assessment for each individual before startung work or at the very least a health questionaire..you are pretty much something into the wind...  

biker1  
#444 Posted : 03 July 2020 15:54:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Originally Posted by: CptBeaky Go to Quoted Post

The photos made it very clear they were not social distancing. I have not jumped to any conclusions, the social media account have shown the offending person holding BBQ parties throughout the lockdown, from day 1. They have shown countless breaches of the guidelines.

This is beside the point. The point is that even when we know that we have employees flaunting the rules outside of work, there is absolutely nothing we can do about it. It only takes one idiot to infect an entire workplace. Unfortunately being a selfish, idiot is not reasonable grounds to suspend someone. 

I suppose you could report them to our world beating track and trace system, at least it would give the call handlers something to do apart from watching Netflix
biker1  
#445 Posted : 06 July 2020 08:16:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
biker1

Well, super Saturday threw up some expected behaviour. Crowded streets in Soho and Portobello, even a mass brawl at a town near us. Ten million motorists heading for the coast.

Second wave here we come.

CptBeaky  
#446 Posted : 06 July 2020 08:24:32(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

Anecdotely, around my area it was pretty quiet in regards to the pubs, which pre lock down was never the case. I was one of the "10 million expected to head to the coast", since I was visiting my mother for the first time since look down. The A14 was very light of traffic heading into East Anglia (on Sunday). I didn't see even a hint of a traffic jam, and held a steady 70mph pretty much the whole way.

Not sure if this isn't just the newspapers going out of their way to find the trouble spots, or just luck on my part.

As for the second wave, I still think we were hit so bad in the first wave it will be more of a few ripples. But then again i thought this would all blow over back in January, so take that with a pinch of salt. Again, anecdotely, it appears the second waves in most countries (and the sudden increase in the US) seem to be disproportionally affected the 15-35's, which is to be expected. The "bonus" to this is that death rates aren't also rising at the same rate that positive cases are.

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