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Ovo  
#1 Posted : 06 August 2020 14:08:37(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Ovo

Saw the horrendous video of the explosion in Beirut from the estimated 2,750 tonnes of Ammonium Nitrate.

I extend my symathy to all involved and although i have fortunately never had to risk assess such a hazard, i am mindful that we as 'Safety Professionals' have a profound duty to educate ourselves about all potential hazards and I for one will be mindful of all COSHH concerns in the future. It's the least i can do.

Yours respectfully, Phill.

thanks 1 user thanked Ovo for this useful post.
biker1 on 06/08/2020(UTC)
peter gotch  
#2 Posted : 06 August 2020 15:27:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Phill

It's a chilling reminder of two things for those looking at nice graphs showing a reduction in the number of eg. Lost Time injuries over time.

It doesn't matter what sector you look at or where in the World. Almost invariably there has been a statistically significant downward trend dating back to about the end of the Second World War, if you look at all injuries including those with RELATIVELY minor consequence.

1. That graph could be suddenly brought into stark relief when a "low probability, high consequence" event occurs.

....but if the organisation is big enough a single incident of such type may not impact the overall trend. So if a multinational counts LTIs in the thousands per year, one incident with say 10 deaths and 100 other injuries may not be easily recognised on the graph. This HAS happened!

2. That graph does not take account of the "COSHH" etc issues where the victims may not suffer this week, this month or even this year.

chris42  
#3 Posted : 06 August 2020 15:51:56(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

Originally Posted by: peter gotch Go to Quoted Post

2. That graph does not take account of the "COSHH" etc issues where the victims may not suffer this week, this month or even this year.

 Or even decades later as per Bhopal in1984.

I once did a risk assessment regarding Ammonium Nitrate and was waiting for some government official to contact my company following google searches relating to it.

Chris

HSSnail  
#4 Posted : 06 August 2020 15:59:30(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
HSSnail

https://www.hse.gov.uk/explosives/ammonium/comah.htm

Storage of amminium nitrate can make a site need to register under comah in uk. I once new of a group of agricultural suppliers cought out because of the volume of "fertilier" they had on site.

But yes tragic that these kind of events keep happening.

Ian Bell2  
#5 Posted : 06 August 2020 16:42:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell2

#1. Indeed be more mindful of your CoSHH assessments. The CoSHH regs are nothing to do with the explosive or oxidising properties of a substance.

stevedm  
#6 Posted : 06 August 2020 16:51:16(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stevedm

the human health impact from this will be felt for years not to mention mental health...I think when Peter was talking about COSHH he actual meant the issues surrounding lung damage from blast and other comorbidities related to the blast toxic release etc...

The impact of Toulouse had ~21 deaths but more than 2000 people's health was impacted by the event...

 

Roundtuit  
#7 Posted : 06 August 2020 21:40:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

The following means absolutely nothing when you are a foreign port with a seized shipment of fertiliser sat in a warehouse but within the UK:

In order to ensure uniformity for economic operators a regulation was issued to regulate the marketing and use of explosives precursors published as EC 98/2013.

The UK adopted the regulation as Statutory Instrument  S.I. 2014 No. 1942 and then in 2015 merged the instruments on Explosive Precursors with those designed to control poisons in the supply chain

The Control of Poisons and Explosive Precursors Regulations were published as S.I. 2015 No. 966

and not a mention of COSHH.

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A Kurdziel on 07/08/2020(UTC), A Kurdziel on 07/08/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#8 Posted : 06 August 2020 21:40:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

The following means absolutely nothing when you are a foreign port with a seized shipment of fertiliser sat in a warehouse but within the UK:

In order to ensure uniformity for economic operators a regulation was issued to regulate the marketing and use of explosives precursors published as EC 98/2013.

The UK adopted the regulation as Statutory Instrument  S.I. 2014 No. 1942 and then in 2015 merged the instruments on Explosive Precursors with those designed to control poisons in the supply chain

The Control of Poisons and Explosive Precursors Regulations were published as S.I. 2015 No. 966

and not a mention of COSHH.

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A Kurdziel on 07/08/2020(UTC), A Kurdziel on 07/08/2020(UTC)
A Kurdziel  
#9 Posted : 07 August 2020 08:08:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

What seems to have happened is that the ammonium nitrate was taken off a cargo ship which had been abandoned by its owners. The port authority had hoped to sell it off to pay for ports fees etc but nobody turned up to buy it (over 2000 tonnes) and so they left it. As and of itself ammonium nitrate is not that that hazardous until either it is caught up in a fire or mixed with some carbon source eg diesel fuel then it becomes a serious explosive although again you can’t just light it with a match. You have to add a lot energy to get the explosive mixture going. What they did to make it go off like this is anybody’s guess. I am just wondering if we will ever find out.

Edited by user 07 August 2020 08:09:45(UTC)  | Reason: missing words

stevedm  
#10 Posted : 07 August 2020 09:45:27(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stevedm

Originally Posted by: Roundtuit Go to Quoted Post

and not a mention of COSHH.

Why are you still banging on that it isn't COSHH....You clearly don't work in the high hazard industries we are all used to looking at the human effects of major explosions and releases....look up OGP 434-14 Risk To Humans and The Green Book calculation on the effects on humans...before you continue....

This is a serious major incident and people have lost thier lives and lots will have health issues for years to come as a result...

Roundtuit  
#11 Posted : 07 August 2020 09:52:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Assembling the pieces of information to date it appears to be a series of unfortunate events - the ship becoming unseaworthy, the courts ordering the fertiliser to be stored, a ship carrying fireworks moored in close proximity to the warehouse and welding being conducted close to those fireworks.

The initial smoke in the footage is from the firework blaze the pressure wave from the ammonium nitrate.

thanks 6 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Acorns on 07/08/2020(UTC), A Kurdziel on 07/08/2020(UTC), CptBeaky on 10/08/2020(UTC), Acorns on 07/08/2020(UTC), A Kurdziel on 07/08/2020(UTC), CptBeaky on 10/08/2020(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#12 Posted : 07 August 2020 09:52:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Assembling the pieces of information to date it appears to be a series of unfortunate events - the ship becoming unseaworthy, the courts ordering the fertiliser to be stored, a ship carrying fireworks moored in close proximity to the warehouse and welding being conducted close to those fireworks.

The initial smoke in the footage is from the firework blaze the pressure wave from the ammonium nitrate.

thanks 6 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Acorns on 07/08/2020(UTC), A Kurdziel on 07/08/2020(UTC), CptBeaky on 10/08/2020(UTC), Acorns on 07/08/2020(UTC), A Kurdziel on 07/08/2020(UTC), CptBeaky on 10/08/2020(UTC)
Ovo  
#13 Posted : 07 August 2020 11:09:43(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Ovo

Thank you all for this much needed information, there are regs here that i had no idea existed as they were outside of my usual remit but i shall look further into them in the future. all part of my CPD.

One apology, i referenced COSHH in error, although i accept there would be subsequent long term health effects that will result from the airborne particles from the the blast, respitory concerns, hearing issues and so on which will of course affect many thousands of unfortunate people, i was initially thinking of prevention of the initial cause which by the content of discussion here may have been fire and DSEAR related.(Obviously there are underlying and root causes which will be determined following what i hope will be a thorough investigation).

As ever, being a safety practitioner i welcome all opportunities to develop my skills and knowledge which is afterall, why i joined IOSH.

Kind regards, Phill.

andybz  
#14 Posted : 07 August 2020 11:12:31(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
andybz

The video footage shows a very significant fire before the explosion. I don't think ammonium nitrate burns so it was something else that caught fire. I presume that was the fireworks being mentioned, but it looked to me like the fire was in a building not on a ship.

There seems to be a lot of focus on the storage of the ammonium nitrate. That may (and I emphasise may) have been OK and actually the main problem may be the storage of flammable materials next door.

We store lots of ammonium nitrate and it is transported in multiple tonne quantities around the country almost continuously.

I find it a bit strange that the incident at West, Texas in 2015 that killed 15 people is not being mentioned in news reports listing previous incidents with ammonium nitrate. Also, Toulouse of 2001 that killed 31 deaths is often being overlooked.

peter gotch  
#15 Posted : 07 August 2020 12:50:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

To clarify, I used a figure of speech....

1 week, 1 month, 1 year, many many years.

Both for the aftermath of an incident such as this, but ALSO all the other occupational health risks that are so prevalent.

UK - relatively few deaths in accidents at work. Circa 12,000 premature deaths per year caused by occupational health risks. Add on the risks that don't necessarily kill (though of course suicide is death) eg. work-related stress and many other issues that can cause life changing conditions.

AND I didn't want to take issue with the original reference to COSHH [This is "Our public forums"]. OK in the UK we would be looking at COMAH and DSEAR, but COSHH was still relevant to the scenario, and many others that we deal with daily.

Mark-W  
#16 Posted : 10 August 2020 06:35:57(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Mark-W

As we all know the IRA used AN to make some of their home made explosives. To be used as a viable source it needs to be of a certain % . I'll not disclose that figure but AN based fertiliser sold in NI had to be below this amount by law. We had bits of kit that could scan/sample it and give a reading that would either prove or disprove it's % concentration.

To make it more effective the IRA used to mix it with other elements, all open source so no secrets here, they used diesel, sugar, aluminium powder and nitro benzine. But in all cases they had to use a kicker charge to start the detonation pathway. THis was usually a small semtex charge.

Just for reference, for those that can remember AN based devices going off, they were in the area of up to 500kg. And we can all remember the devastation we saw. To have this amount detonate is unthinkable, and I'm really shocked at the current low death rate.

My thoughts go out to all involved and I think they have a monumental task of getting back to some normality. But I'm sure with outside help they'll get there.

It also reminds me of the explosion in Cypress afew years ago

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