Rank: Forum user
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I am working on the production of a management of road risk policy. We have essential car users who use their own cars for business purposes. The current sytems in place for auditing licences / documentation etc is very good. One glaring weakness is that these cars could potentially go 12 months without having an inspection or test, which could result in unroadworthy vehicles being used for work. These cars i presume would be termed as "work equipment" under PUWER even though they are not provided by the employer and failure to inspect or maintain equipment is obviously a breach of regs 5 and 6 of the aforementioned regulations.
Do any members know of any workable system of addressing this? Do you get employees to carry out and record checks on their own vehicles periodically? What about competency to carry out these checks (e.g. how do i know whether a tyre is legal or safe)?
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Rank: Forum user
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I imagine that you compensate (£) your employees for having to use their own cars. I would think, therefore, that regular servicing would be something that would be included in the compensation package. Most garages will recommend a number of miles or date to return for repeat servicing and these records could be requested by you for your files as proof of inspection. Just ensure that the compensation package covers servicing costs and that employees are required to provide copies of same for record keeping.
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Rank: New forum user
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Any car over the age of 3 years is already subject to a 'roadworthyness' test... The MOT! could you request copies of these and keep them on file? For cars younger than this, a regular service record would surely suffice? R
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Rank: Guest
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I came across this in my last role. The way we dealt with this was indeed via requesting a copy of the service records for each vehicle periodically.
Also, as part of a smaller guidance document, I outlined basic weekly/ monthly checks that should be undertaken - lights, oil/ water levels, screenwash levels, tyre tread depth/ pressure, etc.
Tyre tread depth gauges are cheap enough, so to enable users to carry out this (the old 10p check is unlikely to work with the new fangled smaller coins...), why not provide one for each driver?
Each driver was also requested to sign and return a declaration stating that they had read and undertood the guidance/ policy, and agreed to carry out the checks/ provide all requested information.
The above said, as it is not unusual for modern cars to now have service intervals of around 20k miles, for remote users that rarely visit the office, how about line managers carry out brief inspections on say, a quarterly basis?
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Rank: Guest
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Darn! I forgot about the MOT!
Essentially, it all boils down to what is reasonably practicable. If it is not realistically feasible to carry out detailed checks either yourself, or via line management, as long as a sensible procedure is properly documented (dependent very much on industry sector), then again, surely this would suffice?
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Rank: Forum user
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Hi All,
the subject of "driving at work" is fast becoming a major concern in the H+S world!
I would suggest that you far more stringent tests and checks, for example
1) Physical checks of driving licenses to ensure that they are valid for the category of vehicle 2) Check the number of points on a license, on a sliding scale ie 0-3 points 12 monthly checks, 4-6 points, twice per year, 7-9 points 3 per year, and any 10+ points every 3 months. 3) Check validity of license. All to easy to have a copy of license with no points on, or a false license. 4) Check validity of insurance cert. Easy to get a cert then cancel the payments!
There are company's who will do all this for you, or at least provide all the tools to do it, and they are relatively cheap. You can register with the DVLA and do the checks yourself, whoever, other Company's benefit from volumes I guess.
5) some sort of weekly of monthly inspection sheet. The MOT is only an indication of the state of the vehicle on a particular day at a particular time! 6) Signed acceptance of your terms re driving at work 7) Issue a drivers handbook 8) Spot checks?
Have fun
Holmezy
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Rank: Forum user
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Is there any case law of employers being found guilty for the condition of an employees own vehicle used for business purposes?
Insurance and license checks are standard but checking for road worthiness of private vehicles?
The RTA applies to vehicles on the road and the driver is responsible for the condition of his vehicle is he not?
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Rank: Super forum user
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I've been asked on several occasions to develop a weekly checklist system for fleet cars to go with our existing range. In truth I had always steered away thinking there was not a genuine requirement. Having read the posts to date I might need to review the situation and add a fleet car inspection checklist to go alongside the forklift, ladder, mewp, scaffold etc. I already have a list of checks I intend to include but any additional suggestions / recommendations would be appreciated.
My argument had always been that the driver would simply backdate the checklist if there was noone around to check up.
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Rank: Forum user
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It is a very difficult one andI think most of the sensible answers have been given. For those that use their vehicles regularly in place of the traditional company car our company gives a car allownace but with that comes of course conditions - including: - submission annually of MOT/service record - submission annually of insurance cert stating business use - we undertake licence checks with DVLA as found paper copy inspection not pick up some big issues
Have to be careful that we are not asking for more than is reasonable - if people not doing mroe than certian miles it is likely they may only get their car serviced annually. also if you try to start to keep detials of oil changes, new tyres you will just disappear under paperwork and that will also preclude those that do certian things themselves. Reasonabley Practicable comes to mind and risk aversion - RoSPA are a good place to look as they have a section on thier website.
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Rank: Forum user
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Regular inspections are certainly a good thing to do, especially of company supplied vehicles. Private or grey fleet are a bit more difficult as you are asking the driver to check something that he owns, rather than you provide. Still good to do it!
You good refuse to pay mileage claims until you see an inspection check list. It doesnt really matter if the driver actually carries out the checks. You will have a piece of paper that demonstrates that you have done all that is reasonably practicable to ensure the driver is safe whilst driving at work!
RTA definately applies when they are on the road, and they are responsible for the vehicle when they are driving it, however, there is still an obligation to do wahat is RP to control driving whilst at work.
The often used saying " your game, your rules" is quite apt in this case.
Holmezy
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Rank: Super forum user
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This question has beeen argued on the forums many times before (in the days when we were allowed to have a good argument on the forums!! ;-)). No agreement is ever reached on whether you should ask people to submit vehicle checks for private vehicles. Private vehicles you have no control over and IMO the Police are better placed to deal with unroadworthy vehicles. As others have said other than licence and insurance checks it is common practice to ask yearly for a copy of the MOT if applicable and possibly evidence of servicing. I don't think you have the right to ask someone to carry out weekly checks and I would proabably say- no it's my vehicle thank you. There is guidance on the HSE website on road vehcile safety - http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg382.pdf
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Rank: Forum user
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ClaireL,
Surely as "tax payers" and "fellow road users" we have the right to expect other vehicles using the highways to be roadworthy?
As employers, I agree it is a difficult issue to get grey / casual car users to carry out daily, weekly, monthly etc inspections and record their findings, however, I think that there is something in the Highway code that suggests these should be done?
I don't think it is un-reasonable to request that employees check their vehicles on a regular basis, and I think, should an accident (whilst driving at work) occur, an employer would be in a far stronger position than if he wasn't requesting the checks, should the HSE or indeed the insurance Company come a knocking?
All of the above is not mean't to upset anyone, just a few points to consider or argue (assuming we can still argue,,,,especially on a Friday), and I won't get upset if anyone thinks my view "aint quite right". I go on holiday tomorrow so I'm not fussed!
Holmezy
or should I be Hol(iday)mezy.....no....that doesnt work!
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Rank: Super forum user
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I am not sure if I can add anything much to the debate that hasn't already been said, although I do believe that the vehicle owner has a responsbility under RTA to ensure the road worthiness of their vehicle, and I am not sure how reasonable it is for the employer to do so. However, to pick up on the reference to PUWER in the very first post; I don't think that PUWER does apply to the scenario described - see para 62 of L22
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