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HarrisTweed  
#1 Posted : 01 July 2019 14:45:24(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
HarrisTweed

Hi All,

I posted a while ago and got very good feedback on Emergency Lighting so trying another here which hopefully can you help with. I've not scanned the World Wide Web as yet but will do it later tonight when I am home.

1) When does a door need to be a fire door? Fire escape doors I understand but fire rated doors. Is their purpose to provide compartmentilisation / contain a fire?

2) When are the regs on compartmentilsation? Most will say refer to FRA but is it any room where there is a chance of a fire starting?

3) Are compartmentilsation reviews part of the FRA or is this a standalone service offering?

Thanks in advance

jwk  
#2 Posted : 01 July 2019 15:06:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

Tricky set of questions Harris, I'll put down my twopennorth but I'm sure there will be more to be said:

Fire doors are used to act as boundaries of compartments and also to protect escape routes. In some environments particular rooms will automatically have fire doors; for example in healthcare premises a boiler room would have a fire door as it would be classed as a fire hazard room, in other premises that would be down to fire risk assessment. Their primary purpose is to protect the occupants of the building from the effects of smoke and flames for long enough for them to escape. They may also act to restrict a fire to one part of a building if the fire service get there in time to put out the fire before it breaches the compartment.

There aren't really any regs on compartmentalisation; building regulations will tell you how to build a compartment, and give an idea of compartment size in relation to travel distances and occupancy, but there aren't any regs that say for x size of building you need y compartments. A major consideration in a large building is distance to a place of relative safety; this would be the next fire compartment to the one that's on fire. Fire suppression systems (sprinklers) are used in buildings where travel distances will be large, such as warehouses. It is all down to FRA.

Would a FRA consider compartmentalisation? This is a discussion we're having with our property services at the moment. We say, yes it should, they say, that's not what the contract with the FRA provider asks for. Me, I acn't imagine why you would do an FRA and not consider your compartments,

John

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HarrisTweed on 01/07/2019(UTC)
Ian Bell2  
#3 Posted : 01 July 2019 15:24:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell2

BS9999 also gives guidance

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HarrisTweed on 01/07/2019(UTC)
AhmedH  
#4 Posted : 01 July 2019 15:49:27(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
AhmedH

In addition to the comments made, fire doors/compartmentation may also be installed for property protection.

The evacuation strategy may dictate as well e.g. blocks of purpose built flats.

There are many guides which are sector specific which will include provision of fire doors e.g. BB101 for schools, HTM "Firecode" for healthcare 

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HarrisTweed on 01/07/2019(UTC), jwk on 02/07/2019(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#5 Posted : 01 July 2019 15:50:21(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/fire-safety-approved-document-b

Updated Approved Document B for the Building Regulations

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HarrisTweed on 01/07/2019(UTC), HarrisTweed on 01/07/2019(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#6 Posted : 01 July 2019 15:50:21(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/fire-safety-approved-document-b

Updated Approved Document B for the Building Regulations

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
HarrisTweed on 01/07/2019(UTC), HarrisTweed on 01/07/2019(UTC)
HarrisTweed  
#7 Posted : 01 July 2019 16:47:23(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
HarrisTweed

Thanks for your comments. Some interesting stuff to follow up on this evening. Your input is much appreciated.

jodieclark1510  
#8 Posted : 01 July 2019 17:19:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jodieclark1510

To confirm compartmentalisation etc sometimes this is caveated by the FRA stating it was based on non intrusive inspection- they may pick up on obvoius breaches but won't take off panelling, go into ceiling voids etc- there are different levels of FRA, and i know you can ask get just compartmetalisation assessments which use boroscopes to inspect.

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jwk on 02/07/2019(UTC), HarrisTweed on 07/07/2019(UTC)
RayRapp  
#9 Posted : 02 July 2019 07:32:32(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

Some good responses, so I will add a few things not already covered. Whether a fire-rated door is required will depend on many different factors - for example, a block of flats will normally have fire-rated front doors. However, if say the ground floor flats open on to a walkway or pavement area then there is no need to have fire-rated front doors.

Similarily, an internal flat will not normally have fire-rated doors. The exception might be if the kitchen door leads directly to the primary means of escape i.e. the front door. If that was the case, then the kitchen would require a fire-rated door.

As can be seen from the above two examples fire-rated doors can be quite a complex matter. That is why the FRA is so important because the FRA should dictate what is required and where.

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HarrisTweed on 07/07/2019(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#10 Posted : 05 July 2019 15:19:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Roundtuit  
#11 Posted : 05 July 2019 15:19:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

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