Rank: New forum user 
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Working on a project where we need to get our overseas vendors onto a construction site so they can install equipment. PC is saying all must have CSCS cards. But how can this be achieved as our contractors are not construction workers but technical workers installing their equipment. I know that CSCS only applies to construction, but our PC is very clear on this. Is there any alternatives or suggestions about going to an alternative route?
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Rank: Super forum user 
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It is unfortunate we still have sites that demand a 100% carded workforce They need to be woken up to the fact that these workers are unlikely to be able to get a CSCS card as their employment is outside of UK construction and the visitors card has rightly been consigned to history. I take it this installation team was documented in your supply quotation?
https://www.cscs.uk.com/applying-for-cards/withdrawn-cards/visitorcard/
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 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
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Rank: Super forum user
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It is unfortunate we still have sites that demand a 100% carded workforce They need to be woken up to the fact that these workers are unlikely to be able to get a CSCS card as their employment is outside of UK construction and the visitors card has rightly been consigned to history. I take it this installation team was documented in your supply quotation?
https://www.cscs.uk.com/applying-for-cards/withdrawn-cards/visitorcard/
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2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
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Rank: Forum user 
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Hi there,
Well, installation is construction activity. Depende of course of the type of installation. You can use this link to find the best card for you https://www.cscs.uk.com/card-finder/. Or you can get a labour card (green card) with one-day training.
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Rank: New forum user
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Originally Posted by: Roundtuit  It is unfortunate we still have sites that demand a 100% carded workforce They need to be woken up to the fact that these workers are unlikely to be able to get a CSCS card as their employment is outside of UK construction and the visitors card has rightly been consigned to history. I take it this installation team was documented in your supply quotation?
https://www.cscs.uk.com/applying-for-cards/withdrawn-cards/visitorcard/
Its a project that is a first for the UK as well so no UK vendors/suppliers unfortunately. I still read this section on CSCS site and think https://www.cscs.uk.com/applying-for-cards/non-construction-related-occupations/
and according to all the cards and the information from CSCS our vendors do not fall into constuction activity. So stuck............. Edited by user 08 October 2019 13:47:06(UTC)
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1 user thanked mattcut for this useful post.
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Rank: Forum user 
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Rank: Super forum user
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The CSCS card is not a legal requirement. It is just a mechanism that some PC use to ensure “competence” of subcontractors. I suspect that these vendors will not be happy having to send their guys across a day early to do a course in language they don’t understand, adding extra travel and accommodation costs and they will adjust their bills accordingly. This might upset the client who might have something to say about this as they (not the PC) are ultimately in charge.
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1 user thanked A Kurdziel for this useful post.
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Rank: Super forum user 
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Originally Posted by: mattcut
Yes. CSCS are completely clear that no-one should be demanding a 100% carded workforce, but some PCs still demand it, presumably because they are too lazy to manage the workforce properly - imposing an inappropriate blanket rule is, after all, easier than implementing appropriate controls.
In addition to the page you've quoted, you could try pointing the PC to https://www.cscs.uk.com/...e-isnt-always-100-right/ which states quite clearly: "This rigid enforcement of a 100% carded workforce results in legitimate, non-construction related, workers being refused entry to site as they do not hold a card. This indicates a misunderstanding of the scheme and undermines the construction industry’s desire for a fully qualified (not carded) workforce." You could ask the PC why they are undermining industry efforts for a qualified workforce? If you have any contact or influence with the client, you could point the client to the same pages. In reality, however, assuming you want to do the work and want to get paid, you'll probably jump through the pointless stupid hoops the PC imposes. (FWIW, we have people that don't qualify for any of the cards. Some of them are serious experts in their field. We tell the PC that if they want the expertise on site, the expertise is coming without a CSCS card (because I'm not telling these people they need to do a one-day unskilled training course and apply for a 'labourer' card). So far, they've always found a way. That might not be available to you, depending where you are at contractually.)
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2 users thanked achrn for this useful post.
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Rank: Forum user
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By curiosity, what are they going to install? What equipment?
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Rank: Forum user
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We had a new build site where we were undertaking the fit out and we were the PC for the fit out, but the PC for the actual build was also still on site. This made for a partenred complaince on almost everything. The build PC required CSCS for everything....we did not require CSCS for various fit out roles. We advised the main build PC this was totally impracticable and unenforcable. We ensured ALL workers received the site induction relevant to the areas in which they would be confined and working, risk assessmnets were robust, briefed out and signed up to. Regular checks to ensure MS were complied with. Result - £11.5m build with 2 minor first aid accidnets on our side and several first aid and lost time on the main build side of things - the same attention they paid to CSCS was not replicated with their site activities or enforcements. Point being, CSCS enforcemetn does not make for a safer site -it's the way the site is operated and managed that counts more.
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2 users thanked TerriCox for this useful post.
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Rank: Super forum user
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I'm in the same boat. I consult to an FM company. Very occasionaly the instal team get a job on a construction site so I'm required to conduct a quick safety check of our guys. I hold the Gen cert not the constr cert. So checking my guys have the correct PPE and paperwork in place is a relatively short and painless process. I've never worked on a constr site outside of the military so have ne real experience of it. When I visit site, I undergo the induction and I'm always escorted around. I hold the visitors card as I have no trade to speak of, I did a carpentry apprenticeship in the 80's but thats not really relevant to now. So my options are to get the PQP card which means I have to learn all the CDM regs which seems disproportionate to the small amount of time I spend onsite. Or the other option is to refuse the work which isn't really a sensible option.
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Rank: Forum user
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Rank: Forum user
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Originally Posted by: TerriCox We had a new build site where we were undertaking the fit out and we were the PC for the fit out, but the PC for the actual build was also still on site. This made for a partenred complaince on almost everything. The build PC required CSCS for everything....we did not require CSCS for various fit out roles. We advised the main build PC this was totally impracticable and unenforcable. We ensured ALL workers received the site induction relevant to the areas in which they would be confined and working, risk assessmnets were robust, briefed out and signed up to. Regular checks to ensure MS were complied with. Result - £11.5m build with 2 minor first aid accidnets on our side and several first aid and lost time on the main build side of things - the same attention they paid to CSCS was not replicated with their site activities or enforcements. Point being, CSCS enforcemetn does not make for a safer site -it's the way the site is operated and managed that counts more.
Why are you comparing a building to a fit-out Principal Contractor? I am not defending the CSCS scheme but I do understand but is an easy way to screen the basics.
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Rank: New forum user
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Originally Posted by: bxuxa By curiosity, what are they going to install? What equipment?
Lots of specialist equipment that is only manufactured by a handful of companies. So they must install due to its nature. As an update we do now have a solution we are working on with the PC.
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