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imponderabilius  
#1 Posted : 23 December 2015 11:35:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
imponderabilius

Has anyone had any experience with NCRQ diploma and if it really is a match against NEBOSH diploma? I've just seen an ad in the latest issue of SHP and I'm wondering if it's anything good. The price is tempting when compared against NEBOSH...
jwk  
#2 Posted : 23 December 2015 12:37:39(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

It does look good and one of my team is interested. Bear in mind though that it still isn't accredited for Chartered or Graduate membership, though that is supposed to happen in January. There are previous threads on this board which do contain comments by people who are doing it, do a search for NCRQ, John
Hally  
#3 Posted : 23 December 2015 13:22:16(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Hally

I'm one of the ones interested in it, but like John has sent above, not yet ratified for Grad or above, so i'm waiting to see what happens in the new year.
George_Young  
#4 Posted : 23 December 2015 14:16:03(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
George_Young

I was planning on doing the NEBOSH Diploma, but I have just looked into the NCRQ and that seems tempting. The no exams part is a bonus, I hate exams.
Thomas Baxter  
#5 Posted : 24 December 2015 11:13:52(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Thomas Baxter

George, Be careful what you say. You don't want to encourage the NEBOSH Diploma snobs! Regards
Invictus  
#6 Posted : 24 December 2015 11:38:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Invictus

George_Young wrote:
I was planning on doing the NEBOSH Diploma, but I have just looked into the NCRQ and that seems tempting. The no exams part is a bonus, I hate exams.
With you on that one George, if you haven't studied for years it is a struggle, there are those still out there though who think NVQ still stand for 'Not Very Qualified' in life we have the doers and the thinkers.
MikeKelly  
#7 Posted : 24 December 2015 12:22:24(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
MikeKelly

Seems like a great idea in concept. And would be a challenge to the Nebosh's [almost]monopoly. I'd like to see more details. Hopefully IOSH will accept the qualification for Grad/CMIOSH status, or explain why not. I'm not sure they will like the competition-I would if it does what it 'says on the tin.' Seasons greetings to all Mike
silverstorm  
#8 Posted : 26 December 2015 00:15:20(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
silverstorm

I was also waiting to see if IOSH would grant accreditation but it looks like it hasn't! There is currently a case for damages open: http://www.catribunal.or...3_NCRQ_Notice_211215.pdf (cut and paste into browser) I hope it does get sorted as it looks like a good qualification and route to CMIOSH.
John M  
#9 Posted : 28 December 2015 15:20:06(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
John M

Silverstorm Thanks for posting the information re the legal action against IOSH. Nothing in the SHP about this or on the Media Centre. Mushrooms and dark come to mind. It would be useful if IOSH would brief its members on where this is likely to lead and where the money is coming from to defend the action and pay out in damages if the application succeeds. Jon
jay  
#10 Posted : 28 December 2015 19:14:07(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jay

IOSH appears to be transparent when it comes to Accreditation of awarding body qualifications to the extent that it has published its criteria. http://www.iosh.co.uk/~/...ations%20Grad1.pdf?la=en Secondly, IOSH has accredited numerous University and other qualifications for graduate membership, therefore it does not favour one qualification over others. Last, but not least, as far as I can verify, the award of the qualification that is recognised by OFQUAL is not by NCRQ, but by AIM Awards-- a fact that NCRQ declares in fine print, but not very conspicously Unless NCQR has submitted greater details to IOSH other than the specification details that AIMS Awards has got on the OFQUAL website, it is evident that NCRQ Diploma is unlikely to meet the IOSH graduate level criteria Workplace Hazards http://register.ofqual.g.../Unit/Details/L_507_0717 Principles of Health and Safety in the Workplace http://register.ofqual.g.../Unit/Details/M_507_0533 Personal Injury Liability http://register.ofqual.g.../Unit/Details/J_507_0716 For comparision:- The NEBOSH Diploma:- http://www.nebosh.org.uk...%20covers74201561241.pdf The BSC Diploma https://www.britsafe.org...on%202015%20%28v1%29.pdf
MikeKelly  
#11 Posted : 28 December 2015 20:33:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
MikeKelly

Interesting stuff, thanks again Silverstorm. We shall just have to wait until the case between NCRQ and IOSH is decided in the Competition Appeal Tribunal after the hearing on 12/13th January. Or any appeals thereafter. We shall then see if Jay's judgement is correct or not. Regards Mike
firesafety101  
#12 Posted : 29 December 2015 10:53:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

We have to understand that there are many people who really struggle with exams and all the learning that has to be done. I have in mind those with dyslexia and other types of learning difficulties. On a personal note I struggled with exams all my life from school through fire brigade and more recently into health and safety. I did manage to find a way to pass the fire brigade exams but without really learning the subject matter and found the NVQ the best route for me as it was work based and producing the required work did prove my knowledge of the subjects. There are people who have no trouble rembering stuff, photographic memory comes to mind and I have no problem with them taking the examination route and they should not have any problem with me and others taking the NVQ route. Horses for courses ha ha
Thomas Baxter  
#13 Posted : 29 December 2015 11:05:23(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Thomas Baxter

Hi all, I've read through other posts previously extolling the virtues of the NEBOSH Diploma over the NVQ route. I chose the NVQ because of the cost involved and I'm not able to take time off work to sit in a classroom. I can't understand these NEBOSH snobs and why they run down people who don't choose the same route as them! It has nothng to do with them. Each to their own. Regards,
jay  
#14 Posted : 04 January 2016 16:24:09(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jay

Stereotyping ANY qualification holders, irrespective whether NEBOSH Diploma, BSC Diploma, University -PgD/MSc, NVQ Level 4 ( now 5) etc is based on individual experience/perception on a very small/insignificant sample and in my view flawed. The key aspect is how the individual with any of the above qualifications fits the job role. For that, it is most likely that the more academic route qualification holders would have to demonstrate how they have applied their skills in practice. Similarly, an NVQ holder would have to demonstrate a wider breath of knowledge in many cases if the role needed that. That is why to progress from GradIOSH to CMIOSH, there is some difference in the IPD.
jim4244  
#15 Posted : 08 January 2016 10:24:31(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
jim4244

Be advised - the NVQ route is not an "easy option". If you complete the evidential based tasks, as they should be, then not only will it take a considerable amount of your time and effort, it will also make you a much better hands on H&S practitioner. The old NVQ 4 took me 10 months to complete, and this was in a 100% safety role in a high risk sector. I then went on and upgraded to the NVQ 5 Diploma. Cost is obviously a big factor and yes, the NEBOSH Dip is more expensive and probably classed as a more "academic" qualification, where, by its very nature, the NVQ is more hands on. James
jwk  
#16 Posted : 08 January 2016 13:24:58(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

And of course the NCRQ dip now takes a middle course between the exam driven Dip and the portfolio based NVQ, as it is assessed on written assignments on taught modules. So there now are three different approaches playing to different people's strengths. Jay, I agree with you entirely, it's all about the right person for the job, and that's a combination of any number of factors. The post-nominals just get you through the short-listing, once you're in the interview it's up to you, John
Safety Man 1  
#17 Posted : 09 January 2016 20:09:57(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Safety Man 1

I think it depends on the individual, I took the NEBOSH Diploma as I wanted to learn areas that I would not come up against in my role at the time, in other words out of my comfort zone, I did it distance learning, yes a lot of sacrifice however I glad a choose that route.
Osprey7  
#18 Posted : 11 January 2016 07:12:22(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Osprey7

This debate always intrigues me as it really is 'horses for courses' as there are so many factors to consider, most of which have been discussed. So whilst a large part of the decision making comes down to the individual's learning preference and affordability, there is another aspect to consider. This is, what are employers looking for? There is no point in getting a qualification if it A) Firstly isn't recognised by anyone and B) If it is not something that employers are attracted to or benchmark against. Whilst the NEBOSH qualifications are slightly "monopolised" the flip side of that is that employers and recruiters alike recognise those qualifications and are a route to formalised benchmarking. If exams are an issue for some learners then the NVQ route or even the Masters route can be options. I disliked exams at school (left without any) and last year completed a MSc through distance learning. This NCRQ until it is given accreditation by leading industry bodies, I personally would leave it alone, unless there is a clause which states that they are endeavouring to gain status and when achieved they will back date any qualification gained. I'll watch this qualification with discernment.
becky.allen  
#19 Posted : 11 January 2016 11:53:36(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
becky.allen

Hi all, Just to let you know that the NCRQ Diploma is now accredited for both IOSH Graduate membership and IIRSM full membership. Kind regards, Becky
jwk  
#20 Posted : 11 January 2016 13:25:04(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

Thanks Becky, one of my team has been waiting for this news, John
John M  
#21 Posted : 11 January 2016 14:01:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
John M

National Compliance and Risk Qualifications (NCRQ) has announced it on their website. This will surely increase IOSH membership. Go for lads and lassies - more and more safety bods in a rapidly declining market. Thank goodness I've got another trade to fall back on. Jon
walker  
#22 Posted : 11 January 2016 14:10:34(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
walker

adds a third dimension to the inevitable debate entitled "mine's better than your's".
dan_ellis  
#23 Posted : 12 January 2016 09:01:54(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
dan_ellis

I am definitely looking at completing this if it saves you the time, money and effort of NEBOSH Dip or NVQ and also can do this during work hours if required. Has anybody completed the NCRQ? How have they faired when moving up the H&S ladder with this qualification? Cheers, Dan
peter80  
#24 Posted : 12 January 2016 09:43:47(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
peter80

Hi Dan, Haven't finished yet - just one assessment to go! It will certainly save you money compared to NEBOSH - quite a lot! As for time, you are not restricted to an examination timetable, so can work at your own pace. As a beginner, I have had to put quite some time into it. I imagine those with some experience could study quicker than me. As for effort - I wouldn't think of NCRQ has being less effort at all. The assignments are great - really get you thinking - but are very challenging. You really have to think about why you are recommending certain actions, for example analysing the risk reduction against time, effort, money - and sometimes when you think about it properly, your opinion and perception changes. Also, one of the assignments was an accident investigation, and I re-wrote my root cause analysis several times over the course of the assessment! I haven't done NEBSOH, but did look at it and the past papers etc. I think the effort required for NCRQ is a different kind of effort. My employer (public sector) has put many of its managers through the NCRQ Cert, so hopefully it will get some recognition as more people complete it.
jay  
#25 Posted : 12 January 2016 12:23:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jay

The tribunal outcome settled on 11th January 2016, prior to the formal date hearing:- http://www.catribunal.or...43_NCRQ_Order_120116.pdf IOSH has had to recognise the Diploma for GradIOSH, but also NCRQ has to meet the IOSH criteria [currently its booklet entitled “Accreditation of Qualifications: Graduate Membership (leading to Chartership)”] Interestingly that this was the first case of its kind under the newly expanded UK regime for competition damages claims! http://theinjunctionsblo...etition-appeal-tribunal/
Angela1973  
#26 Posted : 13 January 2016 15:09:22(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Angela1973

I really like the look of this. I've already done the NVQ 5 and have to get through my advanced fire manager diploma first, but am looking to do a level 6 qual. I'm already CMIOSH so it's not for any other reason than this sounds like a really good enhancement, or do we think if you've already done an NVQ, this would not be worth it? I don't know how you can upgrade from an NVQ 5 to a 6 without paying through the nose, but would be interested in what people think.
walker  
#27 Posted : 13 January 2016 16:05:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
walker

quote=Jay]The tribunal outcome settled on 11th January 2016, prior to the formal date hearing:- http://www.catribunal.or...43_NCRQ_Order_120116.pdf IOSH has had to recognise the Diploma for GradIOSH, but also NCRQ has to meet the IOSH criteria [currently its booklet entitled “Accreditation of Qualifications: Graduate Membership (leading to Chartership)”] Interestingly that this was the first case of its kind under the newly expanded UK regime for competition damages claims! http://theinjunctionsblo...etition-appeal-tribunal/
I can't see anything in there that IOSH wasn't prepared to do all along. This new outfit still have to meet the IOSH criteria that was clearly set out for all organisation's offerings. At the end of the day, employers still need convincing this is an equivalent, good luck with that to all of you pathfinders who have decided on this route.
jay  
#28 Posted : 13 January 2016 17:07:39(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jay

The NVQ Level 5 DIPLOMA offered by City & Guilds and previously by OCR actually has/had "units" at NVQ Level 4, 5 & 6, with the overall qualification at Level 5. http://cdn.cityandguilds...fication_handbook_v1.pdf http://www.ocr.org.uk/Im.../72023-unit-overview.pdf The IOSH route from GradIOSH to CMIOSH, irrespective whether NVQ, BSC/NEBOSH Diploma or University PgD/Degree, is expected to "balance" out the differences in knowledge, skills & ability to apply the knowledge in a workplace etc. Therefore, IMHO, there is unlikely to be a benefit in going for the NCRQ qualification for Chartered Safety & Health Practitioners unless they themselves, after going through the detailed syllabus assess that there is added value i.e. they have missed out significant aspects. Regarding the accreditation by IOSH, we are not privy to what NCRQ has agreed to "adjust". My gut feeling is that the number of hours required for HSD 3 unit may have been increased. My initial posting on this subject did refer to the transparency in the IOSH process , i.e. IOSH Accreditation of Qualifications: Graduate Membership (leading to Chartership)” guidance and that is precisely what has been referred to in the ruling as the guiding document.
imponderabilius  
#29 Posted : 10 February 2016 13:06:57(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
imponderabilius

Hi All, just to let you know I've been in touch with NCRQ people regarding acceptance of their qualification by SIA (Safety Institute of Australia). I was really surprised to get a reply after a couple of days that read: We have now contacted the Safety Institute of Australia to get the NCRQ Diploma recognised for Certified Generalist OHS Practitioner certification (COHSPrac). We have quite a few students who are interested in working in Australia, so I will add you that list and keep you up to date on the progress with the SIA. I'm really impressed by their customer service, support and involvement at such an early stage and it made me decide to do the NCRQ diploma. Not that I'm going to Australia straight away but it's always good to know one's options for the future!
WatsonD  
#30 Posted : 16 February 2016 16:17:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
WatsonD

I am also looking to undertake further training and have been weighing up the NCRQ against the NEBOSH dip. My only issue when I look at the NCRQ units, is they look to me like they were written by the insurance company to their ideal of what a H&S manager would be. A whole unit on personal injury liability in a three unit qual?
gerrysharpe  
#31 Posted : 22 February 2016 07:53:56(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
gerrysharpe

Hi All, I've signed up to the NCRQ level 6 in applied health & Safety, mainly because i wanted an online course that i can do at work or at home and at a time that suits me. The Bonus is the fact that the Course is suitable for people that do not have any safety knowledge means that for those people that work in H&S and have a clear picture of Health & Safety they will probably sail through most of it initially. They say the Duration of the course is 140 hours max but realistically i think you could probably do it in half that if you have a clear understanding of the subject. The fact that they grade you on actual Assessments as opposed to sitting down in an Exam room will definitely be a bonus to companies wanting to do this for their employees. Finally at £395 + vat how can you fault that? So, my username, workbook and personal Tutor will be posted to me in a few days, will keep you updated
walker  
#32 Posted : 22 February 2016 07:59:54(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
walker

quote=gerrysharpe]Hi All, I've signed up to the NCRQ level 6 in applied health & Safety, mainly because i wanted an online course that i can do at work or at home and at a time that suits me. The Bonus is the fact that the Course is suitable for people that do not have any safety knowledge means that for those people that work in H&S and have a clear picture of Health & Safety they will probably sail through most of it initially. They say the Duration of the course is 140 hours max but realistically i think you could probably do it in half that if you have a clear understanding of the subject. The fact that they grade you on actual Assessments as opposed to sitting down in an Exam room will definitely be a bonus to companies wanting to do this for their employees. Finally at £395 + vat how can you fault that? So, my username, workbook and personal Tutor will be posted to me in a few days, will keep you updated
Just be aware when you have passed it you will have the "equivalent" to the NEBOSH certificate.
imponderabilius  
#33 Posted : 24 February 2016 14:30:27(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
imponderabilius

I did NEBOSH NGC two years ago and now I've started NCRQ to become GradIOSH. I'm very impressed with the course from the very beginning - customer support, my tutor's experience and support, the structure of the course... it makes me think about what I do instead of memorizing definitions that mean nothing unless you teach yourself how to apply them... I definitely recommend the course to anyone willing to broaden their knowledge and understanding of occupational health and safety.
BVLockwood  
#34 Posted : 25 February 2016 10:43:40(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
BVLockwood

Hi, Im really interested in enrolling on the NCRQ over the NEBOSH dip and was worried to enroll as I had not heard of anyone else currently undertaking it. Your post has reassured me and i hope to get on board as soon as possible.
imponderabilius  
#35 Posted : 26 February 2016 08:26:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
imponderabilius

Good luck to you! I hope you'll like it as much as I do :)
10MARK  
#36 Posted : 26 February 2016 13:01:04(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
10MARK

I had not heard of this qualification until a couple of weeks ago so when I did I looked at many many job adverts , not one asks for it , it does not seem to be very well known at all !! Does the route to Grad status involve an open book exam for the NCRQ ?
WatsonD  
#37 Posted : 26 February 2016 13:30:03(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
WatsonD

Check out post #27 which should give you an insight
Binniem  
#38 Posted : 26 February 2016 15:14:32(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Binniem

10MARK wrote:
I had not heard of this qualification until a couple of weeks ago so when I did I looked at many many job adverts , not one asks for it , it does not seem to be very well known at all !! Does the route to Grad status involve an open book exam for the NCRQ ?
If you are looking for a quick fix just enrolling on a course is not the answer, for example, obtaining your NEBOSH GC and not having any relevant experience means you'd struggle to get an interview never mind be successful for a job. I've just completed the first unit of the diploma, and found it to be how the real world operates. NCRQ coupled with the relevant IOSH membership level will be fine for my needs, any employer that only advertises NEBOSH General Cert holders, and does not consider NVQ, NCRQ etc, may not be the right employer for me. Just my tuppence worth,
10MARK  
#39 Posted : 26 February 2016 15:46:57(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
10MARK

Thank you for your tuppence worth Binniem and well done on completing your 1st unit of the Diploma. I am not looking for a quick fix because with my Nebosh General cert accompanied by the Nebosh Fire and Nebosh Environmental cert and my National Diploma on the side I dont need one. I have been involved in Health and Safety as a safety rep for around 10 years , a manager another 10 years and employed for the last 6 years in a full time Health and Safety role giving me around 26 years experience. As for turning down a prospective employer by the qualification they ask for seems to be the wrong way around. If a qualification is in demand by employers then surely that is the right one to go for . Im certainly not saying the NCRQ is not a valued qualification to have , just Ive not heard of it or seen it asked for My question was merely out of curiosity !!
imponderabilius  
#40 Posted : 26 February 2016 16:31:16(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
imponderabilius

To me qualification is supposed to give you a certain level of knowledge which, together with experience, make you a competent professional. What qualification it is, should not be of interest to the employer. If a company requires NEBOSH diploma for a position and are not ready to consider another suitable candidate with similar level of formal qualification, than I suppose working with such people in a health and safety role would be a nightmare!
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