Rank: Forum user 
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Hi can anyone please give a definition of competence to train confined space. Im reviewing our internal confined space procedure and training. There is no policy or procedure no inventory and the PTW are preset?The current internal training doesnt include teaching on an inventory, noemergency rescue practical. These guys they have recieved train the trainer but im a little concerned there is some knowledge and expereince missing? I think we require more validation they are competent to deliver this training. our confined space are not high. any comments would be helpful to help me understand what other organisations are doing and decide if i need to outsource this training. Thank you
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Rank: Super forum user
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Confined Space Training standard comes primarily from the Water/ Utilities Industry C&G course...you may not need to go that far to have them all C&G trained, however you can ask that your contractors are :)...if your company is US based then there is a conflict between US guidance on CS and UK...not in principle but the detail is slightly different.. There is a Water Industry Occasional Guidance Note which can help you with the key principles but anything other than Self rescue is a separate course. https://www.water.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/confined-space-update-ed-2-2-oct2009.pdf
Ther are other considerations when it comes to the medical response so there are courses available to enhance the first aiders - supply of medical oxygen, dealing chemicals, H2S response etc
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Rank: Forum user
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The way you describe the arrangements for CSE and the training content, its certainly not sufficient IMHO. CSE I would consider to be a high risk activity, for this reason I would normally use an external training provider that will provide training to an accredited standard and have the impartiality of this method.
When the time comes that you are standing in a dock, answering for the companies ommissions, its slightly more reassuring that this method was followed.
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Rank: Super forum user
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I was a confined space instructor for a very short while when I was in the Army, it is a minefield, or was back then. We had constant refreshers and audits from our management. The Army was very lax on confined spaces training until we had a death, soldiers went into the hold of a cargo ship carrying coal, it hadn't been vented properly and we suffered fatalitys. The Army then went overboard in the aftermath and then it settled down and we set up a training team. We ended up having our own training area set up with sewer pipes, WW2 ammo bunkers, silo's and had acces to the local fire brigades facilities as well. I looked at carrying the training on when I left the service but there was to much red tape for me so I left it
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Rank: Forum user
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It sounds to me that the risk has been perceived to be pretty low given the details provided around internal training, no rescue plan and a generic PTW.
Maybe the best course of action is to re-assess the space and list the likely potential hazards. Quite often spaces are classified as full blown CSE and in my experience once this has been ascertained you cannot operate to half measures. Unfortunately you cannot be half pregnant, so be cautious and diligent in your assessment.
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