Posted By snt "The NEBOSH National General Certificate is not a qualification for health and safety specialists, who should seek to obtain a professional qualification such as the NEBOSH National Diploma" The NEBOSH National General Certificate is a qualification designed to help those with health and safety responsibilities (eg. managers, supervisors and employee representatives) to discharge more effectively their organisational duties and functions. http://www.nebosh.org.uk/awardsnew.asp?ID=5 If this is so, why are employers asking for it. Any explanation on this. To those people with NEBOSH Gen cert, why are you paying overated price for something the provider does not rate.

Posted By Stupendous Man If it is not a qualification for 'health and safety specialists', why do IOSH reward holders with TechIOSH? It would seem far more appropriate to offer Affiliate membership.

Posted By Charley Farley-Trelawney Alas, I fear you may have unnecessarily opened a can or worms, I say unnecessarily because I am far from clear on the point you attempt to make. The NGC has never claimed by itself to create a H&S specialist, indeed, no course and exam make a trained specialist, this is why so many adverts request 'minimum' periods of field experience. I have read carefully what the Nebosh site suggests you may expect from the certificate, it has not changed its stand point, and I have included the unabridged description for a precise response: 'The NEBOSH National General Certificate is a qualification designed to help those with health and safety responsibilities (eg. managers, supervisors and employee representatives) to discharge more effectively their organisational duties and functions. The NEBOSH National General Certificate is not a qualification for health and safety specialists, who should seek to obtain a professional qualification such as the Nebosh National Diploma' It appears to make no false promise, so I am again unclear why you have included the word practitioner when it is not even in the Nebosh description; what is a practitioner? Is it not a Manager, Supervisor, employee rep looking after the company H&S needs and requirements? Lets be clear here, anyone wishing to look after the H&S needs of a low risk industry would almost certainly require little more than the NGC with appropriate practical experience, it is also a great way of finding out that this could be the career for H&S generations to come, there are then many choices. Does it therefore follow that unless you do the diploma you are not qualified to be an H&S practitioner? I think not! I feel certain there will be the responses that will compare a good NGC holder to a poor alternative holder, and they will be correct; what I am certain is that we must not put off anyone wishing to become a H&S practitioner on the basis they think the NGC is not valid!! Of course it's valid, its a contemptible statement to suggest otherwise, its a start, if you wish to take this most wonderful of careers further; check out the many jobs advertised in SHP, NGC as a minimum, IOSH themselves as identified in an earlier response to this posting offer 'tech IOSH' with suitable CPD's. I am certain, hours of exams in 'Management, Hazards, and Practical' for the NGC count for a great deal, and in my career I have met many great H&S aficionados who held little more than the NGC, and in each case they were great practitioners. So what exactly was the point you were making, I see nothing on the Nebosh website that concurs with your bold but ambiguous statement? With respect, what route did you yourself take to become an H&S Practitioner? I am curious. Always, with complete respect for an individuals viewpoint. CFT

Posted By HOWARD SHELDON Looking at this issue from an enforcement point of view it is worthwhile remembering the requirements in respect of persons providing health and safety advice as competent people under the provisions of the Management of Health and Safety at Work Regulations 1999. Obviously the Certificate may be sufficient in low risk premises however beyond this level any employer /dutyholder taking advice from anyone not to Diploma level with a good level of experience would lay themselves open to prosecution . A couple of years back I prosecuted a company for a fall from height accident , their risk assessments , policy and training was of such a poor quality that I was baffled when they said their consultant had prepared it . It turned out their consultant was a quality consultant who had obtained the certificate . The only reason the consultant was not prosecuted was because the company had recieved advice a couple of years before on the qualifications and competency levels that their competent adviser should have . Please don`t put yourselves in positions where you are out of your depth and competency .

Posted By Charley Farley-Trelawney Paul That last question was a cracker! SNT, Thank you for further justification to your original post; I note between your additional responses and your inventive post a reference or three to the cost of the NGC. There are many ways to take the NGC, some far less expensive than others, this is for the discerning student to look into and make their choice. Looking at the NGC as a whole, I do not consider it that expensive, there are exam fees, teaching fees, books supplied, the providers general premises expenses, if memory serves me correctly it is over 13 days, now then 13 days at say £15 per hour (being really tight here) for a teacher is £1560, add to that the previously mentioned items and you end up with £2000 +; for a comparison to alternative routes it seems about right. Our local college is a nominated provider and I believe charge £1000 (must be subsidised) In all it is a great qualification and a wonderful start into the world of H&S, one of which with sufficient time, experience, throw in the odd IOSH course and those CPD's and you are well on your way, and for the record I think its price is about right, sorry if that is not what you thought I would say, I am just being honest in my overall praise for the examining body that will after all offer you the chance to carry on and eventually become a Chartered H&S Professional, now that can't be bad, can it? With respect. CFT

Posted By Dave Wilson Charley, Good maths mate, so 10 students / Delegates at 2k each for 13 days x 10 = £20k for the trainer not bad for 2 weeks work!!!! running 4 courses pa =

Posted By Dave Wilson I thinks that's the point mate, it would be interesting to ask NEBOSH how many of these are presented annually - not passed! but people who actually sit down and take the course. As there must be buckets who fail / dont turn up or never go on to greater H&S heights, interesting!

Posted By Robert K Lewis Then you can equate the cost of a Masters at around £3,500 as less than twice a NEBOSH cert. Which is better to do? I hate to dip my toes in this as I came through the system in the good old days of the Higher and Lower examinations. In those days even University diplomas were not recognised - makes you think of the changes that have occurred. Back to the thread though - This debate will never be satisfactorily resolved because there are both good and bad people doing the job or attempting to do something beyond their skills. The NGC was only ever intended for managers with H&S additions but for some reason it developed into a bit of a monster. It was also left far behind by the developments in the educational world. For what it is and with appropriate experience such people can perform routine roles provided that the risks do not go too high or if they have a wide experience of their workplace. If not the best bet is to find the person best qualified for the task. Bob

Posted By Descarte My NEBOSH Gen cert cost me 120 quid a few years ago from my local college, not an intensive course mind you.

Posted By MSE Bugger. I'm revising for mine on Thursday and Friday this week. Should I bother or just ask for my money back and stick some letters after my name anyway?

Posted By snt Would not even consider sitting for NEBOSH exams, so it is not a matter of failing it. I have due respect for people who have done it. It is about awareness of other routes.

Posted By Miss B Jon B I would appreciate you sending me an email with details of how you acheived your certificate with self learning. I have taken the NGC, construction certificate and then Dip 1. I am looking to take the new level 6 Diploma starting this sept, due to time constraints I am having to go down the open/distance learning routes. The route you took has caught my attention. Folks for what my opinion is worth I don't believe the Dip 1 can be equivalated to the NGC no way! That's after six years very varied experiences of study and work.

Posted By Linda Crossland-Clarke Hi folks A point to throw in on the price of the NGC. Colleges can access funding, so when they charge you a couple of hundred quid for the course, they are also getting another few hundred from elsewhere. Often this doesn't matter on the postcode of the student Training providers don't always have the ability to access this funding, hence the higher price. Funding that is available is generally post code orientated to benefit the region. Regards. Linda SHE Knows.