Posted By Guderian Having followed the discussion the other week regarding legal recognition of the h&s profession, and its now returning comments here, on balance I would be against formal legal controls on the 'profession'. One of the key 'problems' is that h&s covers so many areas and hence levels of competence and knowledge required. Equally and obviously not all organisations have the same hazards and risks - hence lower risk organisations have no business need to pay for highly qualified people (at least on paper) In terms of making a decent salary, it seems to me you take 1 of 2 approaches. 1. Go to be a self employed 'consultant' (leaving aside the qualifcations argument) and then through business development gain enough clients to achieve the economy of scale benefits - fairly generic work/reports but costs fairly predictable - but hopefully get a better salary. The drawback of course, is that the general consultancy market is swamped with 2 week NEBOSH Certificate level people. However for those who might also have a bit of sales banter/make wonderful promises etc to get the work, this is probably a good way to go. 2. Study, get CMIOSH and additional engineering/science qualifications etc and get into the higher risk end of the business, where as I have previously indicated salaries of £50k or so are fairly easy to achieve - then more with additional experience. For the average Joe in a factory/warehouse/commercial environment covering may be 1 - 10 sites, people need to stop kidding themselves into thinking h&s jobs are ever going to pay more than an average salary. At the end of the day, while the skills required do need to be learned etc - most of the work is not rocket science, so will be paid accordingly. For new people coming into the job, they need to think again, but I suppose if they are only earning low £20k's before they come into h&s, its all relative. As others have said, to command the better salaries, you have to justify your salary on a business basis - no free sweets in this world.

Posted By Pete Longworth Guderian Another dose of reality added to the debate. The fact is that if you don't work in the high risk industries such as petro-chemicals, nuclear industry etc etc then the work is for the most part going to be quite generic, and that I think applies to the majority of health and safety "professionals". After all we can't all work in the high risk industries. That said, where does it leave the whole debate about competence, regulation and chartered status? Are we over-egging it just a touch when we talk about vitally important it is to reach chartered status and isn't it time we recognised that the people who hold us in the highest regard and place the greatest value on our importance are ourselves?

Posted By Arran Linton - Smith 9-ship, According to my calculations the average advertised salary in the April SHP is £38,318.79p and if that is balanced against regional/sector variations we are not doing that badly. For example this is equivalent to the expected salary of an Project Architect / 3-5 yrs post-reg See:http://www.ribaappointments.com/default.asp?page=5&gclid=CPm9oNijv5ICFQhIMAodaxJL7g In my calculations I have also included all the trainee and vacancies that are not yet seeking chartered safety and health practitioners. I don't think that this is a bad position as there may be some pre-recessionary adjustment applied to these figures. Anyway a good recruitment consultant should be well aware of what the market is really worth and advising you accordingly.

Posted By murray-t A quote from Guderian “The drawback of course, is that the general consultancy market is swamped with 2 week NEBOSH Certificate level people.” Sorry Guderian but did you start at the top of the H&S industry? Many people with only the 2 week NEBOSH Certificate and lots of experience try and get into H&S but are not given the chance, so the only thing they can do is to go self employed 'consultant'. What I do agree with is the H&S industry needs to be taken more seriously with better pay from top to bottom.

Posted By Ian G Hutchings Hi Regarding consultancy, people who are not experienced or very qualified are unlikely to make much money. People are now beginning to ask more about competence and experience. When bidding for work, especially for small companies, I always make a point of explaining qualifications and giving potential clients the new IOSH guidance about getting help with H&S. What people sometimes don't do is look at employment costs from an employers perspective. If you employ someone you are usually doing so to either stop losses (i.e. typical H&S advisor role) or increase revenue (consultancy). There has to be a link between the two. Unfortunately some companies will go as low as possible because they see H&S purely as a painful compliance need. There are some good salaries in H&S if you are capable, experienced and well qualified. I do find that some people seem to expect to have it all very quickly. Maybe a societal issue rather than just H&S. I started on £15K with a certificate and it has taken me the last 11 years of continual development, further study and very hard work to increase my salary. At the top end of H&S there are now many jobs over £50K and continually other roles now appearing which are up to six figures. Many of these you will not see advertised in SHP as they are managed by head hunters and top city recruitment firms. I have found that usually to get salary increases you have to be prepared to change companies, roles and consultancy can offer the higher ranges, but not straight away. In most small to medium size companies you simply will not get salaries above the average. I don't think we can realistically compare our educational and competency status with that of a lawyer or chartered accountant. The qualifications to become what are seen by society as the 'professions' are much more academically challenging than ours. Ian

Posted By Guderian How do UK safety job salaries compare to similar jobs in other countries - not withstanding any additional variance for the higher oil based jobs in the Mid East and other obscure places that will be higher because of the remoteness etc? Any experience/comments from overseas people?

Posted By Arran Linton - Smith I cannot believe that this thread is still being debated upon the original (unsupported) evidence which is (arguably) misleading. The picture in this month's SHP is very different.

Posted By Arran Linton - Smith .......however there are at least 12 £40k+ positions advertised on the same web-site!