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#1 Posted : 13 January 2009 14:46:00(UTC)
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Posted By mark26
What more can one person do to get a break in this industry it has become so frustrating and down hearting to think nobody can give you a chance to develop your career in Health and Safety i have tried every route possible i.e signed up at every agency on the website, contacted companies direct, sent letters to companies, spent 6hrs a day searching the Internet for opportunity's even offering to work for FREE yet still get no response how did these people in senior positions now get there chance to become COMPETENT everybody has to start somewhere yet there is little chance for people like me to make a career out of this i have never wanted a job so much im highly motivated and willing to succeed in Health and Safety is there anybody out there who is prepared to give me a break if anybody has any suggestions apart from everything i have already done i will be happy to here from you

Thanks

A very frustrated person
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#2 Posted : 13 January 2009 15:06:00(UTC)
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Posted By Wil
Hi Mark.

Which county / area do you want to work?
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#3 Posted : 13 January 2009 15:24:00(UTC)
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Posted By mark26
I live in Newcastle preferably around the north east but as you can see from my post i don't have much choice so i am willing to relocate for the right opportunity
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#4 Posted : 13 January 2009 15:28:00(UTC)
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Posted By Wil
Well hopefully someone up North will pick up on this thread and offer you something. I hear that Northerners are generous and friendly so lets see?
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#5 Posted : 13 January 2009 15:28:00(UTC)
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Posted By David Bannister
Mark, your rant here is hardly likely to win you many offers of employment although I can understand the frustrations of seeking work in a time of reducing employment.

I heard an employment "expert" on 5Live the other day state that the best route to finding a job is by networking your personal contacts (ie friends, family and all their contacts) and most jobs never get advertised. Who do you know who is an employer? Who do you know who knows an employer? Get a referral to these people if you can and make sure that you are able to communicate your strengths in language tailored to the audience and make links from your strengths to the employer's business.
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#6 Posted : 13 January 2009 15:46:00(UTC)
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Posted By mark26
Im running out of ideas now i have tried what you have mentioned in your thread and thought about what you have said the post is not argumentative just an expression of opinion looking for some advice and i no from reading previous threads there are a lot of people in the same situation thinking the same things any positive advice and guidance on what i should do next is welcome
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#7 Posted : 13 January 2009 15:57:00(UTC)
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Posted By CTD
Try Northern Safety Ltd, they may be able to help. They are based in Teesside.

They are plenty of other safety consultancies in the North East also. Why not try them if you havnt already.

Cheers
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#8 Posted : 13 January 2009 16:00:00(UTC)
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Posted By CTD
Also, forgot to say, on Teesside they have TSG Teesside Safety Group, im almost certain Newcastle has something similar, get yourself to the meetings, thats a good time to meet other safety pro's.
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#9 Posted : 13 January 2009 16:00:00(UTC)
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Posted By Scotty
Hi Mark

You don't say what field you are involved in. Have you come straight into H&S or do you have a different background?

It might be worth contacting employers in that specific area as a start (if you haven't already), as you not only offer H&S knowledge but also knowledge of the actual work processes. My background is in nursing and I currently work in the NHS as a H&S Advisor - however, I had left for nearly 10 years to nurse elsewhere, but I could still offer a range of skills, such as ana appreciation and understanding of the technicalities of clinical work, which I guess folk found an attractive option.

Another possible option is to use your 'other professional skills' to get a non-safety related job in that area and work from there - you might be able to develop the safety side once you're in?

It is frustrating, I know, and wearing after while but keep on it and something will happen.

Good luck an keep your chin up.

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#10 Posted : 13 January 2009 16:02:00(UTC)
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Posted By Descarte
In regards to your question I think there are 2 contributing factors currently effecting people in your position getting in to HSE.

I have seen numerous job advertisments (im always looking) being re-advertised again and again with often higher salary grades than previously posted. What this suggests to me is that there is either a shortage of expereinced and qualified safety professionals and/or companies are starting to get competative in trying to attract one.

I am not sure if in the past many of these companies would have (when recruiting for a CMIOSH prefered but not essential position eg. 2+ years experience) been more willing to take on and train poeple with less expereince.

In my experience many of these posts are going for long periods of time unfilled (there is currently 1 at the position I am at now where they havnt been able to find the "right person") where companies are waiting for the right person to come along, saving money in the mean time but then offering more to attract a high end professional.

Is there an answer to this problem (if indeed it is how I percieve), perhaps. Instead of applying for the positions advertised, could you approach the company in writing and offer their services in a upfront and temporary position on an adhoc basis? Thus you would gain the expereince and potentially a full time position and they would have cover and advice dealing with day to day activities until their ideal candidate comes along?

I think what I have just described is basically contract work, perhaps there is a requirement and drive for supply of contractors not only at the high end costing hundreds of pounds a day but also at the starting positions too?

Maybe also an opportunity for a lucrative employment consultant to get in there also, if however this is what some copanies would require.

Sorry for the long post, mental note taken - dont think aloud and type down entire contents of brain near home time

Des
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#11 Posted : 13 January 2009 16:05:00(UTC)
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Posted By mark26
Thank you to the responses it is appreciated and everything that has been mentioned i will try
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#12 Posted : 13 January 2009 20:58:00(UTC)
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Posted By Jane Lowe
Mark - sorry to rain on your parade - your job search sounds just like mine - I too am registered with every agency and spend hours each night searching for suitable vacancies also in the North. As yet I have had no success as there just doesn't seem to be anything out there even for those of us with all the right qualifications, memberships and over 2 1/2 years experience in the field

I sympathise that this really is a difficult industry to get into especially in the current employment climate.

You do not say if you have any H&S qualifications and if this is the case perhaps you should start there. You may also think of looking at related jobs that although may not necessarily be H&S orientated have an element of H&S within them - please feel free to contact me and I can give you a list of all the agencies and website I use and also give you details of some jobs you could try looking at to get your foot on the ladder.

Last of all don't give up - if you have all this enthusiasm and passion regarding Health and Safety you will get there in the end!

Good luck with your search

Jane
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#13 Posted : 13 January 2009 21:04:00(UTC)
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Posted By mark26
Hi Jane i have NEBOSH CONSTRUCTION
SCAFFOLD INSPECTION
PASMA
CAT AND GENNY CABLE AVOIDENCE
ASBESTOS AWARENESS
1 YEAR EXPERIENCE
Thanks for response
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#14 Posted : 13 January 2009 21:06:00(UTC)
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Posted By mark26
And SMSTS SITE MANAGERS
9 YEAR CONSTRUCTION TRADE EXPERIENCE
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#15 Posted : 14 January 2009 10:09:00(UTC)
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Posted By Dav
Mark, now, I am aware that this message may cause slight offence if taken the wrong way, but it is not meant to in any way – please take this as it is meant to be and that is 100% constructive.

Punctuation and grammar would not be the main reason I would take someone on (I don’t claim to be an English professor myself). All the other things which you clearly have such as enthusiasm, drive, determination etc are far more important.

However, having said that, report writing is a big part of being an H+S professional so it is important to be able to get your point across in a clear way, especially when you are trying to convince directors and the like to part with their cash for safety improvements.

I found your postings quite hard to read due to the lack of full stops and commas. Now, once again this wouldn’t stop me employing you at all (and you may reply that in a work situation you would take more time to punctuate correctly), but, my point is that faced with two people who had equally good experience, qualifications, drive, determination etc you have to choose between them somehow. If the only difference was in their report writing skills, then i would go for the one who was the better.

I hope that you don’t take offence at this, but you asked what more you could do, so I thought that I would let you know of my first impression of your post.

As you have seen from this website, it is very hard to get into H+S, especially in the current market. I know of one employer who received 12 c.vs last week and he hasn’t got any positions. They can afford to be very choosy.

Good luck.
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#16 Posted : 14 January 2009 11:11:00(UTC)
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Posted By PL
Hi Mark

I've just done a quick search on the job boards and have found almost 20 H & S jobs around the Newcastle area (inc 4 in Construction, which is where I gues your expertise lies), so there are jobs out there, keep looking and applying.

Many employers are not looking to bring on new people in this current economic climate, preferring to either employ someone with suitable experience who can hit the ground running, or train up people (that they might have had to otherwise let go) from within.

You could give the Newcastle Construction Safety Group a shout, see if any of their members are currently looking.

There will also be members who are looking for someone to train up. I found a young lady on this very forum looking for a start, offered her a temporary position which turned into a permanent position, and when I left she got my job! So it does happen.

Keep a positive mental attitude and work hard at finding a job. You will get there in the end!
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#17 Posted : 14 January 2009 13:16:00(UTC)
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Posted By pat ryan
Mark you may wish to try Balfour Kilpatrick (Balfour Beatty's) M&E Arm.
I know for fact they are recruiting for a H&S advisor covering newcastle at the moment.
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#18 Posted : 14 January 2009 13:40:00(UTC)
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Posted By Lynn Judge
Have you attended our local IOSH Branch meetings. This would get you in contact with other H&S professionals who may know of vacancies as well as giving you the opportunity to update your knowledge. I would also agree with an earlier respondent who suggested you take a little more care over your spelling, grammar and punctuation. First impressions do count a great deal.
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#19 Posted : 14 January 2009 13:44:00(UTC)
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Posted By Bob Youel

network as much as possible - attend every CDM support group, IOSH, IIRSM, BSC meeting that you can
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#20 Posted : 14 January 2009 15:34:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Fraser

Hi Mark

Getting into health and safety is quite an arduous task, partically in the current economic climate around the uk.

What has worked for me is to match the qualification to the experience gained in health and safety, and perhaps use any angles that you have to get into safety the way as others have advised above. I was quite lucky with my first role several years back about a 100 went for the post ( and I luckily got the position ) sometimes all you can do is construct a good cv, get an interview, attend the interview and give a good account of yourself and hope your face fits in. I think you should be yourself at interview stage and have multiple interviews as a fall back if you are pipped to the post in my opinion.

There certainly will be a house building /maintenance boom in the public sector for socially deprived areas in the uk - perhaps it could be worthwhile looking at contractors who principally carry out refurbishment and social housing / facilities management, as I think these are the contractors who will be in the driving seat over the next couple of years.Anything relating to private housebuilding / commercial refurbishment is struggling at the moment. They are always looking for safety people and in the type of business where there is sustainable growth over the next few years thus giving people a chance to establish themselves in their career.It is just a case of keep trying and something will break.

Good Luck and keep trying.

John
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#21 Posted : 14 January 2009 16:56:00(UTC)
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Posted By Sharynne
What is your background/skill set?
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#22 Posted : 14 January 2009 18:04:00(UTC)
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Posted By mark26
Hi Sharynne, my background is in construction.
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#23 Posted : 15 January 2009 14:05:00(UTC)
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Posted By Raymond Rapp
Mark

Email me when you get a chance and I will pass on some contact details of a company in utilities/civils/construction that may be worth as shot.

Ray
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#24 Posted : 15 January 2009 20:49:00(UTC)
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Posted By sezm2105
Hi Mark,

I'm in the same boat myself and it does get you down. What I am trying to do is keep thinking its ok its all interview practice but still.... No advice really other than what you know keep on going and getting more frustrated!

A fellow frustrated individual.
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#25 Posted : 15 January 2009 20:54:00(UTC)
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Posted By RobB
I can feel your frustration. I had difficulty initially but got my current position from a speculative letter sent as a mail shot to health and safety companies in the areas I wanted to work. There wasn't a position immediately but when one arose my c.v. was already there!
Good luck.... don't take just anything, keep your standards.
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#26 Posted : 15 January 2009 21:34:00(UTC)
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Posted By KATE BYRNE
Hi Mark
I just wanted to give you some hope in you current struggle. I kept posting on here for a long while after completing the NGC. Then out of the blue I got an email from now my current employer!. I know the current climate is quite bad at the moment but I just wanted to say that employers are always reading posts but maybe not replying!. My boss's first email said to me "your persistence has impressed me". So listen to the other guys who giving good advice and keep posting your experience and location.

Good Luck
K
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#27 Posted : 20 January 2009 12:01:00(UTC)
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Posted By Phill Firmin
I admire the enthusiasm and since you are prepared to relocate, I would strongly recommend that you contact Hays H&S in London (I am sure you must know them), ask for Steven Bryan, their section manager - you can mention my name if you wish. They usually take a lot of interest in potential placements and will give you good advice, I am sure.

Steven sometimes makes comment in the SHP and a recently responded to a question in 'How do I get there?'(December 2008) which was 'Overcoming being typecast as a specialist'. It is brief but interesting and may assist you in some way.

A word of advice too - think about how you come across, it is important and be prepared to quietly get your feet under the table and wet for a little while in something like 'site inspections' if you want to make it, it is not an easy profession by any means. Once you get on the ladder make a career plan to achieve the status you desire and go for it 'gradually', I am sure that's what Grad IOSH must really mean!

Best wishes from someone who has been there and done it - frustrations and all!

Phill Firmin.
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#28 Posted : 23 January 2009 00:10:00(UTC)
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#29 Posted : 23 January 2009 08:23:00(UTC)
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Posted By IOSH Moderator
Mark - the previous message was removed because it was spam.

Moderating Team
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