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Posted By Mark Eden
Will there be any implications on large bussinesses if and when Fire-Fighters go on strike? i.e. Will companies who are unable to guarentee the safety of employee's in the event of a fire be breaking any Health & Safety Regulations.
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Posted By David Mains
Will there be any implications on large bussinesses if and when Fire-Fighters go on strike?
Yes - basically if the business goes on fire then it aint getting put out! I don't mean to sound flippant but that is the long and short of it.
As for the H & S of workers (and others), it is impossible to guarentee this but employers should be controlling the risks of fire (and smoke) and have suitable evacuation procedures in place should a fire occur. The difference now is that if a fire does ocuur you cannot expect a fleet of fire engines to tackle it. A business may have to postpone certain tasks (e.g. hotwork) or reduce work that involves using flammable materials for the duration of the strike.
Another point to consider is chemical spills. At the moment the fire brigade tackle these, but the army are not trained or equipped to do so.
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Posted By shaun mckeever
It may also be a time to review your fire risk assessment if you have done one or if you haven't then you should do so immediately
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Posted By Laurie
You should also review your evacuation arrangements for the disabled, particularly the mobility impaired.
If you use the refuge principle then your on site teams are unlikely to receive any professional assistance/back up
Laurie
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Posted By shaun mckeever
What do you mean by refuge principle?
I ask this because some people think that disabled people should be left in a refuge point within a building and wait for the fire service to rescue them from there. This is not the case. Employers must have proper arrangements for evacuating disabled staff at all times whether there is a firefighters strike or not.
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Posted By Charles New
Shaun
Whilst I agree that people with special needs should be able to evacuate to a place of safety along with the rest of the workforce, the use of refuges is endorsed by the Home Office in their publication 'Fire Safety - An employers guide'.
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Posted By Laurie
Just to amplify my previous response. In the event of a fire, our mobility impaired people are put in a refuge initially, and then evacuated using an evac. chair once the initial surge of people is over.
One of my blocks is 9 stories high. When using the chair to evacuate from the top floor professional fire fighters will normally be on the scene within minutes (they have never taken more that five minutes), long before the evac. party reach the ground floor. The firefighters normally either take over, or offer advice and encouragement, or just standby. This gives a lot of confidence to both the operators and the evacuee.
During the strike this will not happen, and evacuation may take a lot longer (wasn't it something like 45 minutes at the Trade Center?), and be a lot more stressful.
It is this which must be risk assessed
Laurie
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Posted By Mark Betton
Back to the issue of the refuge principle for persons with disabilities:
My fire evac procedure for the buildings I manage has always stated that PWD who are unable to evacuate themselves should wait in the lift lobby for their floor (which is a 3 hour fire compartment) with a designated fire marshal.
On arrival of Fire and Rescue, they will be evacuated by Firefighters using the Fire Fighting lift (or other method deemed most suitable by the OIC at scence).
This part of the procedure was devised by us after seeking (and failing to receive) advice from Fire and Rescue for the past three years.
Now my policy (despite being previously approved by F&R Fire Safety) has been criticised - as they insist that it is the Building Operator's responsibility to evacuate PWD - F&R will only assist where "resource allows"!!!
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Posted By shaun mckeever
Charles
Please read the section on Refuges in Fire Safety: An Employers Guide more closely. Refuges provide a temporary place of safety to wait for others to help them out of the building - 'others' does not equal fire brigade. The employer still retains responsibility for making arrangements for the safe evacuation of all their staff 'without' the assistance of the fire brigade. In a city centre like London it is unlikely that you would have to wait for long before the fire brigade arrives, however if your office block is in the middle of nowhere would you be happy leaving a disabled person in a refuge point and saying to them 'don't worry the fire brigade will be along in about half an hour'.
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Posted By Laurie
Just another quick word about leaving a fire marshall or other companion with a disabled person. While this is certainly our policy, it does not meet with the approval of my local fire prevention/safety officer, who says that should anything go wrong with our on site arrangements, they are left with two people to rescue instead of one.
There cannot be many of us who would simply leave a disabled person in a refuge and totally evacuate the building!
Laurie
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Posted By Graham Bullough
Just some thoughts regarding the attitude of Laurie's fire safety adviser against a disabled person being accompanied while they remain in a refuge area in an evacuated building. There are good reasons for a companion - preferably one with a reasonable knowledge of the building's layout: Firstly, the companion will provide moral/psychological support. It must be very disconcerting remaining in a building while everybody else is leaving, and the fire alarm is sounding at high volume. This applies especially to visitors. As mentioned in previous threads which deal with disabled persons and evacuations there should be telephone links provided for refuge areas so that management and the fire brigade know who remains in the building and where. Secondly, the companion can, if necessary, assist the disabled person to move laterally within the building or downwards using an "evac-chair". The responses to this and related threads indicate that different fire brigades/fire officers have different approaches as to whether or not firemen assist with routine evacuation of disabled persons.
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