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Posted By John Birch
Hi Guys and Gals
Can anyone help. Most of my engineers believe that, as a principal contractor under CDM, if we contract out a lifting operation to a crane hire company then the full responcibility of the lift is taken on by the crane hire company.
I am uncomfortable with this and believe that under CDM the responcibility rests with ourselves. Can anyone point me to any clear information regarding this point
Many thanks
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Posted By Oliver Whitefield
John
You are right to be uncomfortable with this arrangement, as the Principal Contractor you have full responsibility for the co-ordination of all H&S matters on the site. This includes those of all (sub)contractors, of which the crane hire company is one.
You are also responsible under LOLER for ensuring the equipment hired is suitable for the job and under CDM for ensuring that the crane hire company is competent and adequately resourced to do the job.
Under LOLER the crane hire company is responsible for ensuring the equipment is maintained, inspected and tested as appropriate, and the information is passed to the hirer.
Also under LOLER (Reg 8) you are required to have an appointed person with responsibility for the organisation and control of the lifting operations.
What does your Construction Phase H&S Plan and risk assessments say?
For further information refer to CITB GE700, HSG150 - H&S inConstruction and HSG224 Managing H&S in Construction.
Also try:
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg290.pdf
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Posted By Alan
John,
If you conract out a lifting operation to a crane hire company you still have overall responsibility for the operation. You may still allow the crane hire company to undertake all operations, but you must ensure the competency of the company and of the persons working for the contractor. Your best way of doing this is by clearly stating in a letter of contract your requirements, stating that all operations must be carried out safely and must comply with relevant legislation, including LOLER. You should ask for the certifiates of competence and test of the persons operating the crane and on any persons appointed by the contractor (or by yourself) to supervise the lift.
Ensure that you get a copy of the current test certificates and certificates of thorough examination of the equipment (including chains and other accessories).
On top of that ensure that they provide you with a set of realistic and workable risk assessment and method statements, and then ensure that they work to what they say they will do.
If you are not happy with what they are doing whilst on site, stop the work immediately until you are satisfied. If anything goes wrong, it is your company who is in the firing line unless you have done everything reasonably practicable to ensure the competence of the contractor and their safe system of work.
But don't get too bogged down by the contractor. You make sure they know the site and the lift and of any specific hazards, but let them plan the lift - they are the professionals.
Hope all this helps,
Alan
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Posted By Laurie
Never mind your engineers - check with your lawyers (or insurance company).
There is a whole raft of case law where the client, i.e. the principal contractor, has been held responsible.
Laurie
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Posted By Adrian Watson
Dear John,
The general principle is that any person who hires a contractor to do work for their undertaking is responsible for that work to the extent that they have control of the work. See HSWA 74 (Chapt 34 s3 & s4.) and R v Associated Octel Ltd [1996]4 All ER 846
This position is reinforced within the CDM 94 regulations.
As previously stated you have to take reasonable measures to check the competence of your contactors. This should include;
1. Asking for references and visiting other works in progress;
2. Stating what the work is to achieve, when and where is to done and what standards are to be met;
3. Then allowing them to describe how they are going to do it in a plan of work and method statement;
4. Evaluating these documents; and
5. Then verifying that they are working in accord with these documents.
One last point, Keep an Audit Trail!
Regards Adrian Watson
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Posted By Robert K Lewis
The purpose of a contract lift is devolve much of the detailed responsibility for the lift(s) to the contractor. Yes you do have residual general duties regarding the ensuring of competence and contractor co-ordination BUT if there is a problem within the lift operation itself, eg a crane overturns say, then the Lifting Company are responsible - Case Law supports this and it is partially why the HSE and crane hire companies have been pushing the appointed person route for those without experience and available expertise. Unfortunately the Hire companies have then attempted a de minimus approach and not used a Lifting contractor but a slinger signaller type when offering a Contract Lift.
For large complex lifts I would still use the likes of Heavilift and others to take on the planning and design of the operation and the relevant equipment selection. The on-site responsibilities are then drastically reduced.
Bob
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Posted By keith molyneux
I believe that the misunderstanding has come about as a result of the Contractors Plant Asssociation (CPA) discussions with HSE last year which produced a best practice guide that has been adopted by CPA. I don't believe this alters the principle contractor duties/responsibilities under CDM but clarifies who has specific roles relating to appointed persons, supervision competence etc, and whether it is a "contracted lift" or "crane hire".
The basic difference:CPA Crane hire is contractually the customers responsibility if things go wrong. The customer must provide the appointed person and retains most of the insurance responsibilities.
CPA contract lift: The crane, operator and appointed person are mainly the crane owners responsibilty if things go wrong and the owner will provide certain specified insurance cover.
I have some documentation which outlines this if you are interested e mail me at keith.molyneux@knaufinsulation.com and I will send you a copy.
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Posted By Steve Sedgwick
Follow Bobs note it is good advise.
I have had the experience where our engineers employed a crane hire company to do a complex lift. They thought that they had arranged for a "managed lift" and it appeared to be well planned by a senior person in the crane company (a national company) but when the crane tipped over we found that the contract was not for a managed lift.
I found that at the time that the crane company did not employ enough competent people to get insurance for these lifts and preferred not to do them i.e. take full responsibility.
The Factory Inspector placed the blame with us for this; he stated that had it been a fully managed lift then he would have looked towards the crane company
Also note that there is a big difference in price between a fully managed lift and arranging for a crane, driver and slinger.
Steve
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Posted By Robert K Lewis
Just taking this a bit further - I have asked our plant hire manager to look at what is being offered and it seems that the Appointed person is being offered without insurance in some places or by some companies which means that this is not a CPA Contract Lift. The pricing suggests what I felt - that a gang leader is being offered not the Appointed Person as defined in the regs.
If you want a Contract Lift you must make certain that this is what is stated on the final order before it is signed. Don't allow things to proceed without the copy order being checked first by someone able to understand the nuances.
Bob
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