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#1 Posted : 29 April 2003 16:57:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Harrison I am regularly asked the question by older workers about the practise of giving a pint of milk per day to welders and people working in dust and fume emitting jobs. It was I think considered at one time to have some health benefit. Does anyone know what the thinking behind this was and when was it started?
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#2 Posted : 29 April 2003 17:58:00(UTC)
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Posted By Graham Sargeant Not sure if what I know is true or an old wives tale, but I was led to believe that galvansed metal fumes can cause calcium deficency? Would be interested to know outcome of this thread.
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#3 Posted : 29 April 2003 20:52:00(UTC)
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Posted By Merv Newman John, When I was at school, mid fifties, our boiler stoker was allowed an extra half pint of milk per day. I think this just allowed him to breathe easier in a dusty atmosphere. I would put it down to an old wives tale and check the actual atmospheeric concentrations of contaminants to see if any further control measures are required Merv Newman
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#4 Posted : 29 April 2003 22:51:00(UTC)
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Posted By Paul Craythorne Funny but I don't recall seeing a pint of milk as a recognised control measure within the COSHH ACOP. This reminds me of a dispute that I had a few years ago when I stopped the annual free issue of a pair of jeans to machinists who were historically given these as a form of protection against contamination from mineral oils. How jeans are meant to prevent cancer of the scrotum is beyond me and I doubt whether they fall under the category of PPE. It's a strange old world in H&S. Regards, Paul Craythorne
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#5 Posted : 30 April 2003 10:04:00(UTC)
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Posted By Jay Joshi There is an HSE publication, "Her Majesty's inspectors of factories 1833-1983 : essays to commemorate 150 years of health and safety inspection", published in 1983; ISBN 011883711 that has an article, "150 years in the treatment and prevention of lead poisoning by medical means- A Historical review" that gives some insight into why milk was provided prior to The Lead at Work Regulations. Those subscribing to full text databases such as Technical Indexes or Ovid(previously Silve-Platter, now OVid, marketed thro' Croner CCH) should be able to access it. I have included some selected extracts below, but it is better to read the full article to get it in proper context:- "By the mid-1920s, on the best of scientific principles, milk was still being advocated as a source of calcium, the rationale now being that it would immobilise lead by impeding its liberation from the bones". "In 1941, a standard British work on clinical medicine was advocating a high calcium content diet in the prevention of lead poisoning and commented on the customary practice of providing workmen with a glass of milk each morning to assist the storage of lead in a harmless form in the bones". "In 1975, milk was still being widely used to prevent poisoning, though by now there was no agreement that one or two quarts of milk a day had a place in the medical control or treatment of toxic lead effects. Opponents of high calcium diets argued that if calcium drives lead into the skeleton, this merely delays excretion and increases the total body burden of lead, apart from the hazard of a high calcium intake for those who form stones readily. Furthermore, it was observed that this type of medical intervention postponed proper engineering control. Treatments to mobilise stored lead rapidly fell out of favour" "By 1975, an authoritative French book on occupational health concluded that drugs had no role to play in the prevention of lead poisoning; on the contrary, they would present an additional physical hazard and lead to neglect of the only effective preventive measure, namely engineering control. Good social hygiene was recommended and milk was considered to have no value" "The practice of providing milk in industry dies hard. Its use is widespread. From being restricted to workers spraying lead paint, a daily supply of milk was extended to painters spraying non-lead paints and workers in environments with irritating dusts and fumes. While cold milk may soothe the dried and inflamed pharynx temporarily, it is no substitute for a healthy environment." "In 1983, the control of lead at work is seen to be a matter of good engineering control: the medical role is defined as determining how effective this has been in preventing levels of exposure at which excessive lead absorption may occur. Today, there is no reason why workers cannot be protected against lead poisoning and the hazards of medical prophylaxis and treatment avoided"
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#6 Posted : 01 May 2003 08:33:00(UTC)
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Posted By Jane Blunt Dear John Your first respondent refers to galvanised fumes. The inhalation of zinc fume can cause metal fume fever, which is a flu-like illness. It is not related to this issue, so far as my research has shown. I am aware that welders have often been given milk, and the practice does die hard. I know that while I was working at a certain organisation of some repute in the welding world at the beginning of this Century, the welders were still getting it. It is very difficult to withdraw something, once started. Milk was given as a precaution against Occupational poisoning, but by 1960 there was sufficient medical evidence to refute any claim of its usefulness. The Research was done by the West German Federal Ministry for Labour and Social Affairs and the German Society for Occupational Safety. They proved that there was no scientifically reliable evidence for a protective or preventive effect of milk against the occupational effects of dusts, smokes, gases or vapours. The International Institute of Welding Commission VIII, Health and Safety, prepared a statement which was published in Welding in the World in 1992, volume 30, no 7/8 page 153. Basically they say that there is no evidence that milk either inhibits the take-up, nor helps in the removal of pollutants from fume from the human body. It is also known that the possible hazardous substances in welding fume are absorbed almost exclusively via the airways, and not by ingestion. Other references - the titles of which give you the flavour of the beliefs (they are all German, and these titles have been translated): Deutsche Gesellschaft fur Arbeitsschuttz 'Is milk a protective or preventive measure against occupational poisoning?' vol 10, no 3, 1960, p76 Hoschek & Fritz: 'The milk myth', in Pocket book for Medical Occupational Protection and Practice of Occupational Medicine, published in Stuttgart, 1978. Valentin et al, 'Illness caused by lead or its compounds' in Occupational Medicine, also published Stuttgart 1979 Wittgens, 'The effectiveness of milk in preventing lead poisoning' Zbl Arbeitsmed, vol 3, 1953 Wittgens & Niederstadt, 'Investigations into the value claimed for full milk as a protective measure against occupational poisoning', Zbl Arbeitsmed, vo 4, 1954. Jane
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#7 Posted : 01 May 2003 09:59:00(UTC)
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Posted By Gavin Gibson In a previous company we provided milk for our asbestos workers, but NOT our welders. Again this was based upon historic factors rather than any current medical information
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#8 Posted : 01 May 2003 13:16:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ian Bruce This reminds me of when, working as a Health and Safety Officer in a prison which had a welding workshop, I was first asked about milk provision. On "old lag" accosted me one day while I was reviewing our COSHH assessment on welding and checking ridiculous control measures such as LEV, safe systems, PPE etc. He demanded his pint of milk and insisted I sort it out "'cos you're health and safety". The milk was the only control he needed to stop the effects of weld fume, all the other stuff was no good at all, apparently. My laughter was rudely interuppted by his apparent wish to discuss this further via the medium of a hammer in my head! I beat a hasty retreat and jokingly told the shop supervising staff, unfortunately being overheard by another group of prisoners, who then demanded that although they weren't welders, they were also exposed to the fumes and they should have the milk as well! You can imagine the fun that they had as they "protested" about they're pint of milk! Oh, happy days.
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#9 Posted : 08 May 2003 14:28:00(UTC)
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Posted By Geoff Burt I've managed to get hold of a copy of the essays from the BL. It's a fascinating read - anecdotes for training courses are supplied in the hundreds! Thanks for the information. Geoff
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#10 Posted : 09 May 2003 09:29:00(UTC)
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Posted By George Wedgwood Who says learning is dead! This has been a fascinating thread and well worth the read - I too remember milk being given in the steel works to scarfers and burners as an 'antidote' to lead and weld fume. IOSH shouls capture stuff like this for a historic hazard 'dictionary'!
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#11 Posted : 09 May 2003 09:50:00(UTC)
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Posted By Jay Joshi It may be worth requesting HSE to make this publication on essays available on the HSE website--perhaps on the health directorate pages!
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