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#1 Posted : 17 September 2003 16:02:00(UTC)
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Posted By Jim Walker
Did anyone watch this on TV last night?

How can Bristol (or wherever) get away with allowing contractors to wallow in raw sewage without any controls in place?

If this were a commercial organisation the HSE would come down like a ton of bricks.
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#2 Posted : 17 September 2003 19:22:00(UTC)
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Posted By Emma J Forbes
I saw it - couldn't believe it myself. I'm pretty new to Health and Safety so I get really quite excited when I see things like this and telling anyone who'll listen to me what laws they are breaking - my partner is starting to see where the Health and Safety jokes stem from!!
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#3 Posted : 19 September 2003 10:07:00(UTC)
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Posted By Dave Wilson
As an ex EHO local government workers and WA people are exposed to this all the time, exactly what kind of safety measures do you envisage when dealing with this stuff.

In london people walk around in this allday!

Remember you are only inches away from millions of gallons every day in the sewers.

I would recommend a visit to a sewage works to understand what exactly is entailed here.
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#4 Posted : 19 September 2003 11:10:00(UTC)
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Posted By Jim Walker
Dave,

You obviously didn't see the programme. The operatives (council contractors) were paddling around in a garden flooded with raw sewage in trainers. The camera followed one bloke home, clothes covered in you know what. There was then a narrative about his wife making him change & wash before entering the main part of the house. The wife had recognised and implemented controls to prevent spread of disease to the other members of the family - not the employer.

FYI - in another life I was a microbiologist working on anaerobic digestion of sewage, so I've waded in the......, myself.
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#5 Posted : 19 September 2003 14:32:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ian Mycroft
I've seen a few of these programes shot in various cities and unfortunately Bristol is no better or worse than any of the others. I wondered if the local enforcement officers had seen the program, but then I realised, the Local Authority in question were the enforcing authority. The adverse health effects of paddling around in raw sewage is well documented in history, that's why we now have sewage treatment systems instead of just throwing everything out in the street. So why do these Local Authorities allow their operatives to work in such an unsafe way?

Having said all that, the series about Sheffield was shot mainly on location in my son's bedroom!
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#6 Posted : 19 September 2003 15:36:00(UTC)
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Posted By Peter Lee
Ian,

I didnt see the program myself but have to point out that Local Authority Enforcement Officers do not enforce their own workers, nor do they enforce on domestic premises,this would come under the remit of HSE.

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#7 Posted : 22 September 2003 12:24:00(UTC)
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Posted By Dave Wilson
Jim,

Didn't see it but if what you say is true then I would be very surprised if the Council workers did not have the propers equipment and tools to do this job in a safe manner.


When I worked the Dirty gang, waterptroof ovies, wellies, gloves, hard hat, mask and vaccinations etc.

Would this not be a prima facie case for prosecution and even internal disciplinary measures if the said equipment was not used.

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#8 Posted : 24 September 2003 10:37:00(UTC)
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Posted By Jim Walker
Further this thread last week.
There was another episode last night.

It would appear it is OK for Bristol council contractors to ride in the buckets of backhoe machinery too.
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#9 Posted : 24 September 2003 10:55:00(UTC)
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Posted By Jason Gould
I can see this turning into a regula occurance with life of grime.

I failed to notice backhoe incident but was wonering what happened to the needles. Did they go into the skip in those bin liners etc. That flat was disgusting and I have the deepest reservations about the cleaning proccess.
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#10 Posted : 24 September 2003 11:22:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ian Stone
I only caught the end but would it be normal practice to have staff swimming around in thick deep sludge of a pond?
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#11 Posted : 24 September 2003 11:44:00(UTC)
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Posted By Sean Fraser
Has anyone actually passed on these concerns to Bristol council?

Doesn't this hark back to previous threads which bemoan the manner in which H&S is portrayed in the media and advertising circles, either by belittling H&S policy decisions that are seen as ludicrous or by continually displaying photos/activities where safety has obviously either been ignored or worse, not even considered? At the time, we asked what we should do about it - in the case of a council that should know better, perhaps we should be engaging their PR department! But it should it be a local concern or can anyone join in?

What we seem to be saying here is that the statutory enforcement body doesn't apply the same MINIMUM standards on its own personnel that it does on those it is obliged to inspect. Yet another example of do what I say, not as I do . . .?

From previous responses I expect that any members challenging the transgressor can state that they are members of IOSH, but are not officially representing the Institution itself. Only our elected officers could reasonably claim to represent the body. But saying you are a member and are concerned at the way Bristol is being portrayed, not just because of the way it reflects on the Council itself but also the example it is setting, would add weight to the engagement. At the end of the day, all we would be doing is passing on a concern - only their own people can make a legal challenge should they be harmed.

I find these threads interesting, but I wonder how many of us are actually taking any form of action as a result.
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#12 Posted : 24 September 2003 13:52:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ian Minty
I'm amazed that this thread han't been pulled yet!

Recently I highlighted an individual's web site - along similar lines to this discussion (ie I was amazed that this was up for public consumption and nothing had been done to rectify it.) - and my posting was pulled for a breach of the acceptable use guidelines ie "Users must not use the forums to make complaints against any individual or organisation."

You'd better watch out Jim!
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