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#1 Posted : 30 September 2004 16:08:00(UTC)
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Posted By Martin Taylor As many safety officers I am assuming that most of us aim to influence safe practices by information and persuasion etc etc. However there are times when the carrot doesn't work and the stick comes into place. How then do people determine the level of punishment appropriate to the safety violation. Do any people out there have prescriptive measures out there to guide management through a disciplinary code e.g. failure to wear safety shoes = verbal warning, working a machine with guards missing - instant dismissal. Any ideas welcome thanks Martin
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#2 Posted : 30 September 2004 17:37:00(UTC)
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Posted By Merv Newman Negative reinforcement such as warnings and disciplinary action are totally inefficient. They have only a short term effect and require that supervisors are always on the look out for infractions and are prepared to apply punishements consistently. Take a look at behavioural safety where we recommend that you recognise, reinforce and reward safe behaviours. It is much easier to do and more "user friendly". Unfortunatly it requires management and supervision to change their approach. e.g. when was the last time your boss thanked you for just doing your job ? Merv Newman
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#3 Posted : 30 September 2004 19:55:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Murgatroyd A website saves a thousand words, so have this one: http://www.rydermarsh.co.uk/BehaviouralSafet.html
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#4 Posted : 30 September 2004 20:48:00(UTC)
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Posted By Laurie Our policy makes it quite clear that persistent breach of health and safety requirements will be regarded as a disciplinary matter. Once this has been invoked, whether it be for the said H&S, harassment, discrimination, bullying et al. there is a set procedure, through the HR Department, involving both employer and employee representatives, for assessing the gravity of the offence, and the sanctions to be imposed. Laurie
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#5 Posted : 30 September 2004 22:05:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Murgatroyd Yes, my company has that attitude as well. I got told to work on the centre lathe, which has a chuck guard fitted. The guard has a switch, and cannot be operated with the guard out of position. The microswitch stopped working, and was wired out-of-circuit so the lathe could be used. I refused to use the machine, since the company H&S policy stated that all safety devices were to be working and used. Start: company disciplinary procedure. So I telephoned the area H&S office and had an inspector call round (well, it was a bit harder than that, but)..result, new switch and since I hadn't had the necessary training in use of the machine, they were told I couldn't use it. Company safety policy again....funny how companies seem to have these policies, but never bother with them ? Oh, and since they have a dust problem, and no extractors, I made sure that when the weather gets bad they are likely to have a H&S guy around...not a lot they can do really....that old H&S policy again....prepared by a pro H&S consultancy.....cost their insurance 98 thousand so far in claims...
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#6 Posted : 01 October 2004 11:04:00(UTC)
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Posted By Alec Wood We all appreciate the viewpoint of "negative reinforcement" being inefficient in the longer term, and the idea that the carrot is more efficient than the stick. But we do have to face the issues of the real world too where we will always come across those thankfully rare individuals who consistently believe that they know better. I guess that it is these individuals to whom the questioner refers. I have often found that it can be difficult to get the HR department to appreciate the gravity of the offence, so it can be helpful to write a restriction policy into your standard working procedures instead. For example, if a warehouse operator arrives to work without his safety boots he cannot work in the warehouse where the wearing of such is mandatory. Managers will find him another task or send him home to get his boots, in his own time. If your safety procedure is to be taken seriously, then you must be prepared to punish those who consistently and routinely defy the safe systems of work you have put in place. This has top applied at all levels. The case mentioned by John above is an example of poor practise and attempted enforcement only at the shop floor level. Surely the lack of action taken against the person who ordered the bypassing of an interlock is indefensible. Alec Wood Viewtek Display Services
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#7 Posted : 01 October 2004 19:57:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Murgatroyd I'm reminded of a remark, made on a tv program, by one of the "captains of British industry": "There is no such thing as a bad workforce. There is, however, such a thing as bad management leading to a bad workforce"
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#8 Posted : 02 October 2004 08:50:00(UTC)
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Posted By Martin Taylor thanks to Alec for writing my resposne for me - and thanks to other respondants for making me look at my own thinking more closely. We are looking to implement behavioural safety over the next 12 - 18 months and it is absolutely correct that this is the primary tool - both at shop floor and supervisor level and pure discipline will be the death nell of this approach. However as Alec states I am concerned that there will always be a small core of people who BS will not work for and these people need to be dealt with an ultimately removed from the business through a escalating disciplinary procedure. Given this - and I am sure that there are many businesses out there who have dealt with this matter - what does such a policy look at and how does it work? thanks all for you input so far - look forwards to lots more discussion Martin
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