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#1 Posted : 25 January 2005 19:18:00(UTC)
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Posted By M MacDonald Hi, What action should be taken for employees who have came into contact with white asbestos? (Small amount on one occasion). Thanks, M
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#2 Posted : 25 January 2005 23:48:00(UTC)
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Posted By Sylvia Tyler Let your Employers Liability insurers know the details of the incident - with any investigation of how exposure took place. He will them keep it on record in case of a claim in years to come. Ensure you change your systems of work and educate employees in asbestos recognition to prevent a repeat. Sylvia
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#3 Posted : 26 January 2005 07:14:00(UTC)
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Posted By Chris Boocock If you e-mail me, I'll return our procedure. Regards - Chris
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#4 Posted : 26 January 2005 08:48:00(UTC)
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Posted By Martin A Stear Although I would investigate why it happened to ensure it doesn't happen again, the likelihood of disease from a one-off expoure to a small amount of white asbestos is negligible, if not nil. Clearly it depends on the level and duration of exposure but for the individuals involved, it should be put in context to avoid undue anxiety. There's sometimes a misunderstanding that seeing asbestos in bad condition means exposure occurs.
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#5 Posted : 26 January 2005 13:17:00(UTC)
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Posted By Steve Cartwright You don't say what condition the asbestos is in. Is it in cemented form or pipe lagging. What condition is it in. Have you had it analysed. Some asbestos insulating boards have been known to contain blue, brown and white asbestos. If your employees have been exposed to any loose asbestos fibres, inform your insurance company, you will also have to report it to the HSE (RIDDOR), exposing your employees to dangerous substances. I would also get hold of a copy of Managing Asbestos in premises. HSG227. This will give you all the information you need.
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#6 Posted : 26 January 2005 17:17:00(UTC)
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Posted By M MacDonald Thanks for all the advice. We have recently purchased new premises (a 1920's building) which we are in the process of renovating. The Facilities technician disturbed some white powder while painting. A specialist company are coming in to remove the remains at the weekend. Only 2 employees were 'exposed' for a very short period of time to a white powder. I will report this to the Employers Liability insurers. Should i report it to the HSE?
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#7 Posted : 27 January 2005 09:26:00(UTC)
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Posted By Tom Clark A 1920's building - has the previous owner or anyone carried out a Type 3 asbestos survey? If not why haven't you? Before any work takes place in a building that old you should have this survey carried out to then produce an Asbestos Register for the building. You will need this register to refer to when carrying out future works. I would suggest you do it sooner rather than later. Remember that some building materials were being used up to 1995 with asbestos content. Regards
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#8 Posted : 27 January 2005 09:59:00(UTC)
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Posted By Pete Driver Do you have a list of which ones Tom?
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#9 Posted : 27 January 2005 13:04:00(UTC)
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Posted By Andy M, Is it Asbestos, has someone presumed, or has someone competent assessed the likelihood of it being Asbestos? White Asbestos or Chryostile doesn’t necessarily have to be white or white powder, it usually depends on what it was bound with. Before anyone over reacts, get a competent person to have a look, and if necessary then get a survey. If you have asbestos on your premises, you have several duties under the Control of Asbestos At Work Regs, suggest you take professional advice on complying with the regulations, and also you take the advice given on this forum. If someone confirms you may have asbestos through a visual survey, and are renovating, get a type 3 survey, which will access and survey all areas. If not renovating, a type 2 might be more appropriate which surveys areas that are reasonably accessible, takes samples, but also assesses the state of the asbestos, likelihood of access etc and gives you an estimate of risk. Like I said, get some professional advice. 1. Investigate, prevent it happening again 2. Get a survey 3. Write procedures for working with/accidental exposure, write a management plan to detail how you will manage asbestos in your building if it is there 4. Get necessary staff trained who may be exposed to asbestos, and who manages the work/building 5. Get the right PPE and issue as emergency pack in case of accidental exposure, as whilst you might contract work with asbestos out, your staff might still disturb it accidentally as you have stated. Hope this helps. Contact me directly if I can help further.
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#10 Posted : 27 January 2005 14:23:00(UTC)
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Posted By Stacey R Collins Andy makes a good point. I attended an incident of suspected "white asbestos" contamination on a dealing floor which turned out to be vermiculite powder coating for fire proofing that became dislodged when someone was working in a ceiling void. The important thing not to do in your situation is panic
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#11 Posted : 27 January 2005 15:32:00(UTC)
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Posted By Liam Mc Conalogue Did you not receive an asbestos survey report from the seller. The Control of Asbestos at Work Regulations 2002 (CAWR) introduce an explicit duty to manage asbestos in non-domestic premises, which came into force on 21 May 2004. This places a duty to manage for those in control of a non-domestic premises. check out the following website for details http://www.hse.gov.uk/campaigns/asbestos/duty.htm Hope this helps.
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#12 Posted : 28 January 2005 16:00:00(UTC)
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Posted By Pete Driver Hi Tom - what asbestos materials were used up to the mid 90s? Pete
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#13 Posted : 28 January 2005 19:27:00(UTC)
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Posted By Paul Leadbetter A type 3 asbestos survey would normally only take place before demolition or major refurbishment of a building. A type 2 survey would involve taking samples to identify any asbestos-containing materials. Paul
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#14 Posted : 03 February 2005 18:28:00(UTC)
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Posted By Pete Driver Does anybody have a list of the building materials that contained asbestos AND that were used up to 1995?
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#15 Posted : 04 February 2005 13:36:00(UTC)
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Posted By Anthony Elsmore Pete, There simply is no definative list of what building materialscontained asbestos were in use until 1995. The only way to be sure is to have a type 3 survey done from a UKAS registered Laboratory Examples of Asbestos containing material are: - Pipe lagging, insulation boards, Fascis and Soffits, Ceiling tiles, Floor tiles, floor tile adhesives, artex coverings, Fire protection coverings, window seals, plastics, roofing products, M&E connections, internal partitians, electrical fuse boards. The list is quite literally endless.
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#16 Posted : 04 February 2005 14:06:00(UTC)
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Posted By Pete Driver No the list is not endless. A contributor said ACMs continued to be used ie installed, up to the 1995. I'm looking for a list of materials which were being manufactured up to 1995 and/or were being used (fitted) up to that date. If indeed ACMs were being manufactured and used up to 1996 I would be surprised if there were more than a handful - but wouldn't it be good to have that list simply as a source of up-to-date information?
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#17 Posted : 04 February 2005 14:12:00(UTC)
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Posted By Pete Driver For the avoidance of doubt I would like to see a list of ACMs which were fitted or installed on building sites in the 1990s - not 1989 or earlier.
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#18 Posted : 04 February 2005 15:25:00(UTC)
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Posted By Anthony Elsmore Pete, The point I was making to the all users of this forum (which is people of all H&S experience)is simply that just because you are in a modern building C.1990+ does not mean that ACM products will not be present. Take for example moved machinary from one site to another, or fittings and fixtures that may have been purchased, sat in storage, then used. This does happen so has to be taken into account. It is a brief insight for tenants of older buildings of the range of ACM's. I fail to see why you would like a list of ACM containing products post 1995 though, for two reasons. 1) You would have to find all manufacturing companies operating at the time, find out what they were making and in what quantaties- Who is going to do that? 2) If you treat all products as containing Asbestos until proven otherwise as the CAW Regs state why would this be necessry anyway?
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#19 Posted : 04 February 2005 15:37:00(UTC)
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Posted By David J. Hi. I would concur with most of what has been said and advised. You should: confirm that the material does actually contain asbestos, if you do not have a survey you must get one ASAP. You need to put in an asbestos management system - An asbestoslog book/register, every contractor should consult this prior to starting work, sign and acknowledge that they will not break into/disturb the asbestos. If an employee has been potentially exposed they should consult a GP. If you have an occupational health provider you should consult them. The HSE must be informed. Re materials containing asbestos as indicated these are many and varied. AIB is probably the biggest worry in buildings as it has a high asbestos content. You should be aware that the HSE have included artex in the list of materials to be managed under the asbestos regs. Bottom line you must survey, identify and manage asbestos in your building. If you don't have the expertise on site you will need to bring in a specialist. And, in this era of "no win no fee".. definately let your insurers know Cheers
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#20 Posted : 04 February 2005 16:48:00(UTC)
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Posted By Richard Labrador I suggest you have the white powder analysed in case it is not asbestos. This proceedure could save you considerable expence if it turns out not to contain asbestos.
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#21 Posted : 04 February 2005 17:18:00(UTC)
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Posted By Pete Driver Is it not the case that anything that could cause risk in the maintenance and demolition of a building should be contained in the H&S File and that this would include asbestos. We're talking pre 1995 not post!
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#22 Posted : 07 February 2005 14:25:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ron Hunter For those in this thread who are looking for a wee bit more on the use of asbestos/types of product, there is some good info on the Asbestos Information Centre site (www.aic.org.uk) - see the 'trade names' section
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#23 Posted : 07 February 2005 15:21:00(UTC)
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Posted By Steven Mellor If you would like additional information about sampling or survey work please email me: stevenmellor@sbmsafetysolutions.co.uk
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