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Posted By kev clarke
could someone tell me what is accepted as a way of an employee, who is classed as a D.S.E. user, being informed of their rights to regular eye tests that are paid for by the company and assistance with the cost of glasses as required? i.e. should the notification be in writing, be spoken or simply be available in, say, a company manual, without an indication that the information is there? not having been told of this right, now that i know it, can i claim back monies for tests and glasses i have paid for myself?
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Posted By Richard Mathews
Our organisation informs employees of their rights at induction and on the one day Health and Safety Awareness Workshop that everyone has to attend within their first three months of employment. If you have paid for the test yourself then you may be able to claim it back.
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Posted By kev clarke
tnx for reply. any other information would be welcome.
best regards
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Posted By Lorraine Shuker
In my view it would fall under the requirement to provide information so should be openly advertised and staff encouraged to avail themselves of their rights.
After all a negligence claim could be made for associated problems which in the end would be more costly.
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Posted By Robin B
I don't think you would be able to claim for 'back payments' but I suppose everything is possible.
The employer must inform you of the arrangements and provision for eye tests. Once you are aware of the provision of testing YOU have to ask for that test to be done. Once the first test is done the company can then insist on regular check-ups.
So if you can prove that you hadn't been told of the tests you MAY get 'back money' if you want to rock the boat
Robin
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Posted By Ron Hunter
Strictly speaking, prospective employees should be made aware so that the successful candidate has an opportunity to have vision tested/corrected before commencing employment (becoming a User). (Regulation 5(1)(b))
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Posted By kev clarke
tnx to all for replies. i am a little surprised at Robin B's response about 'rocking the boat'. surely if the company hasn't fulfilled it's obligation under the regulations, that is a misconduct on it's part? after working for the same company for more than 4 years, and only finding out this info recently and by chance (none of my work colleagues were aware of this regulation either, or so they have said), surely i and they, would be entitled to some sort of re-payment. after all, i have paid for all eye tests and glasses myself when some of the cost could have been covered by the company? 'rocking the boat' now could save them money in the future, as stated by Lorraine Shuker. i would also have thought that any retaliation by the company would lead to greater recriminations on them. any further comments would be appreciated.
regards
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Posted By Geoff Burt
Is the information in their H&S procedures?
If so I guess that would be seen as being public enough - the argument being that as an employee you should have read them!
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Posted By kev clarke
not as far as i am aware.
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Posted By Clive Cooper
Kev.
As a user you are entitled to the cost of the eye and eyesight test. But remember that you are not entitled to the cost of spectacles unless they are specifically for VDU use (That’s in the DSE regulations, and there is a free leaflet on the HSE website). And even then, your employer only has to provide basic eye correction. So no designer glasses with tints!
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Posted By Robin B
Kev
if you have the knowledge to access this site I'm sure you also have the access to the 6 pack. The dse regs quite clearly state that the employer must inform users of their rights to recieve free eye tests and basic corrective equipment.
Your original post suggested that you were the only person effected by this breach of regs.
You're right Kev. The company is in breach of Regs You've been there 4 years and you feel that ignoring this part of the dse regs is more important than [most likely] the many others?
Yes I still say rocking the boat. For what? back payment for perhaps 2 tests and 2 pairs of glasses
Retalliation by the Company? Well yes I suppose you could take them to an Industrial Tribunal! There is the whistle blowers protection after all!!
Robin
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Posted By kev clarke
no offence meant here at all Robin B and i am not considering a Tribunal action or 'whistle blowing' either. the more people that i work with and i ask if they knew of these regs, the more deny any knowledge. there have been no H&S issues with us that i know of until now. my employer seems quite 'Safety Concious'. it just seems to me that this reg has been ignored or overlooked maybe because of the payments involved to staff? i am just trying to find out where we stand and then find out why we weren't told in the first place. if the information is 'somewhere', it would have been helpful to tell us. whether i or anyone else then bothered to read it would be down to us. no complaints then.
also, i am aware of the cost of glasses available to employees, paid for or contributed to by the employer. i am only trying to find out what i, and others, are entitled to and should have been made aware of.
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Posted By Robin B
None taken
When I do the DSE assessments part of the questionaire asks if they are aware of the provision of eye tests. Have work station assessments been done?
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Posted By kev clarke
i have no idea if any assesment was done or not. something else to find out, it seems. tnx for tip.
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Posted By kev clarke
hi. need a little further info if someone can help please. are there any industries/ types of employment/ workplaces that are exempt from these regs? if so, what are they? does wearing glasses prior to becoming a dse user affect a person's rights under the regs? look forward to comments.
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Posted By Geoff Burt
No and No
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Posted By kev clarke
tnx very much Geof for reply. i handed the receipt to my manager yesterday for the eye test i had done on 13/06 and told him the price given for the cheapest pair of glasses sold by that optician. the response was 'i need to talk to you about this'. didn't sound too favourable to me.
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Posted By kev clarke
hi. have just been given a little more info. it appears that the senior manager resposible for, i believe, human resources, is looking into the regs further. i am awaiting the decision.
as i work as an I.T. trainer, would i be classed as a dse user? my job involves instructing clients in the various programs within microsoft office and marking exams. i can not perform either of these functions without looking at a computer screen and cannot see what is on a screen or the exam papers without glasses.
look forward to replies, and offer my thanks to all who have given advice and opinions so far.
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Posted By kev clarke
hi. tnx to clive for response. i had already looked where you suggest but have now printed out the document. this is one that is handed to our new clients but never been given to me as an employee. i agree that i could have read it, but did not realise it was for staff as well. mistake on my part? maybe. the only problem with the info here is, i feel, that it isn't specific as far as job roles are concerned and that this allows for interpretation to suit employers. disagree?
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Posted By Clive Cooper
Kev.
This is the HSE guidance on the DSE regulations definition of a user:
Who is a DSE User?
Where it is clear that use of DSE is more or less continuous on most days, the individual concerned should be regarded as a user. Where such use is less continuous or frequent, it is sensible to assume that someone becomes a "user" where a majority of the following criteria apply.
1. Work often requires the use of a display screen for a continuous or near continuous period of an hour or longer.
2. The display screen is used on most days, or every day.
3. The worker has to transfer information quickly to or from the DSE.
4. The job could not be done without being dependent on the use of DSE.
5. High levels of concentration and attention are required.
6. The worker has little choice about using DSE.
In situations where an individual is not a user, the employer should still ensure the protection of employees by assessing the risks and by taking the necessary control measures based upon the ergonomic factors applicable to the use of DSE.
This should help.
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Posted By Peter Taylor14
the information should be available in h/s policy but you should be informrd of the risk presented at work and the control measure in place probably at induction
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Posted By David J Jones
It looks to me that your company either does not have a properly structered H & S Policy document or if it does have one it doesn't include it as part of the induction process. A well written policy should include DSE, along with the provisions of the applicable regs, under "Arrangements".
Perhaps your HR person may need to review the company induction process.
David
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Posted By kev clarke
tnx to all for responses and info. i have still not heard which way i and my colleagues are to be 'classifed'. will post back when i have further details. many tnx again.
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Posted By kev clarke
hi. sorry for the delay. i was told some six weeks ago that the head of human resourses of my company sent an e-mail to my manager. i have not seen this e-mail but was told yesterday (09/08/05) that it says that 'the company are under no legal obligation to pay for glasses or eye tests'. i have asked for this to be confirmed in writing by either a representative of iosh or the hse but i guess it means they are not going to class any employees as users and we will get nothing from them. i will show printouts from this site and others to my manager and ask him to contact the human resources head again next week. i would welcome replies and suggestions yet again from anyone here. best regards
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Posted By Frank Hallett
In essence Kev, your employer has clearly failed to provide adequate information that they are obliged to provide by law; it appears that they have also avoided their duty in respect of complying with HSWA Sect 9 in this respect - both are criminal offences by the employer as well as opening the possibility for civil action.
I cannot support the implications of Robins responses - this lack of action will do nothing to improve the employers approach; though I do agree that there are a wide range of possible routes to acceptable remedies that should be explored thoroughly before litigation is pursued.
The underlying implications of your post are worth giving further consideration to however Kev. If the employer is failing on this extremely simple topic, where else are they failing to meet their duties under H&S? There is almost never just the one blip of failure to effectively manage H&S, there is usually a pattern, whether it be of good or bad management.
Good luck
Frank Hallett
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Posted By MichaelM
Kev
It seems that your employer does not know the regulations and are in effect in breach.
If PPE in the form of DSE Prescription Safety Spectacles are required for the set distance to use the computer then they must comply and pay the minimum amount (you can put more to this to get the Gucci glasses). If these prescription glasses are required for reading or seeing into the distance as per ordinary prescription spectacles, then they are not DSE spectacles and they will not have to pay for them.
It is legislated that any item of PPE should be supplied free of charge to employees (unless they make additional payments to get better looking PPE).
Hope this is of use.
Michael
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Posted By kev clarke
tnx very much to frank hallet and michaelm for the responses. the problem i am faced with now is which route to go down. do i ask the company to get written confirmation from a member of iosh or the hse that the company view is valid? would anyone from either organisation give that confirmation or advise that the view is incorrect? as it took approx 6 weeks before i was told of some of the contents of the e-mail reply, how long should i allow the company to get this confirmation? if this is not forthcoming, what would be the best alternate route? as robin said earlier, there is the whistle-blowing option. i do not want to take this option. i am sure i would be dismissed in one way or another, but feel strongly that the company should comply with this rule if applicable. would showing the replies here be sufficient? would any of the responders object if i did this?
again, be grateful for replies.
best regards
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