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#1 Posted : 16 June 2005 17:32:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ian Waldram I have been contacted by someone who works as a cleaner in NHS. She has daily cleaning duties in a patients' smoking room in a mental hospital and has become concerned about her exposure to smoke. One simple change has been made, i.e. smoking stops 15 minutes before her cleaning schedule, but so far the employer and Union working together havn't come up with any other controls, nor have they really kept her informed re progress, though she knows there is discussion about getting the patients to dispose of their own smoking rubbish - but that won't eliminate the need for room cleaning, nor reduce her exposure to residual smoke, the amount of which she reports as significant. I know that setting up 'no smoke exposure' arrangements for workers in residential settings can be very challenging. Forced ventilation for the room would be an obvious improvement, but someone would still have to maintain it, and thus be exposed intermittently. Does anyone have experience of other low-cost solutions I could suggest that really work? She is dedicated to her work, understands that for these patients a 'no indoor smoking' rule is unrealistic, but is clearly also concerned about her own health. No suggestions about who else she or I could contact please - I know there are several other sources, but for this message I'm looking for effective and proven controls known to Forum participants. Thanks for your help.
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#2 Posted : 17 June 2005 10:49:00(UTC)
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Posted By Frank Hallett Good morning Ian I know that you will have already formulated your own opinions on this and are probably looking for confirmation. For what it's worth, here's my 2penn'orth based upon your observations. The Cleaner must be directly involved as per either Safety reps regs or Consultation Regs [whichever is most appropriate to her position]; There is no legitimate excuse for the lack of mechanical ventilation. This should be amongst the first improvements to be put in place; An appropriate CoSHH Assessment for both airborne and deposited nicotine is urgently requirred; An appropriate CoSHH Assessment for cancer-inducing substances [tobacco and the smoke etc]should be given immediate consideration; A suitable SSoW should be introduced that protects ALL staff from the effects of smoking exposure and specifically addresses the Cleaners involvement; The potential need for Health Surveillance [as required by MHSW & CoSHH] should be thoroughly and seriously considered. I'm sure that there are further issues that others will identify, but if the above are addressed, the principal ill-health consequences will be minimised to a defensible level. Frank Hallett
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#3 Posted : 17 June 2005 11:58:00(UTC)
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Posted By Lumpy How about employing a smoking cleaner to undertake tasks in this area.
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#4 Posted : 17 June 2005 15:48:00(UTC)
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Posted By jackw. Hi as a LA Social work department we have similar problems not just for cleaners but for staff, who often have to enter these rooms to support residents. There is no way around it... .resident’s require support and rooms need to be cleaned. We undertake risk assessment re the room and fit extractors of sufficient power to clear the room of smoke, which appears to work reasonably satisfactorily. Doors are also kept closed to prevent smoke from getting out into other areas. I am afraid I can’t suggest much more. As for employing a SMOKER to do the cleaning .. yer having a laugh mate..
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#5 Posted : 17 June 2005 16:59:00(UTC)
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Posted By Andy Petrie I agree with Rob on this, the levels she is exposed to will be negligable and likewise so will the risk. You sould have a mechanical extract though, they don't cost much.
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#6 Posted : 18 June 2005 03:46:00(UTC)
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Posted By Messy When considering electrical fans for areas such as this (Mental Health), you may wish to install a PIR fan operating switch so that the fan switches itself on when the room is occupied. I have been involved with a large Mental Health unit which suffered numerous false alarms when the smoke detection in neighbouring areas was activated by smoke leaving the room as clients turned off the fan as it was "too noisy". Secure or hidden wiring connections are also advisory, as clients (intent on a quite smoke) will disconnect any fan given half the chance. However I do agree that the risks appear negligble (bearing in mind the existing control measures) and the cleaner perhaps should stop wwhinging and get on with it. This case reminds me of a window cleaner (at a previous place of work) who refused to clean the windows as they were too dirty!!
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#7 Posted : 18 June 2005 15:24:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ian Waldram Thanks for your interesting responses. I've noted all points made, including that the risk is possibly negligible, and passed them on to the cleaner - in appropriately diplomatic language! Incidentally, I've also learned that although Scottish Executive plan to issue Regulations quite soon to ban smoking in most enclosed public spaces, including workplaces, psychiatric hospitals are a proposed exclusion. However some Health Boards are already introducing programmes to help such patients quit, as there is then a clear anomally between acute and psychiatric units.
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#8 Posted : 18 June 2005 17:29:00(UTC)
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Posted By Bill Fisher A posting has been removed from this Thread as it contained a paragraph which was in breach of the Acceptable Use Guidelines; it was likely to antogonise another writer. The message author has been invited to repost his message with the offending remark removed. Bill Fisher (Moderator)
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