Welcome Guest! The IOSH forums are a free resource to both members and non-members. Login or register to use them

Postings made by forum users are personal opinions. IOSH is not responsible for the content or accuracy of any of the information contained in forum postings. Please carefully consider any advice you receive.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Admin  
#1 Posted : 29 June 2005 09:57:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Richard Chalkley Opinions please - I am having a debate on the methods of implementing COSHH. I have come accross 2 distinct approaches to COSHH: 1. Assess the procedure and include all substances hazardous to health. The assessment may then be a broader assessment to comply with MHSWR etc. 2. Assess the substance and then refer to this in you other risk assessments. I'll hold my cards close for the moment and disclose my modus operandi later once the debate is in full swing. Thanks, Richard.
Admin  
#2 Posted : 29 June 2005 10:05:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Heather Aston Richard In our case definitely the process approach. Substances can affect one another and you do not take this into account in the individual substance apparoach. Also we have a weighing prcess in our Mixing dept which involves several hundred substances - imagine doing an individual assessment for all that lot! We do assess each substance for toxicity and suitability of use when it is first introduced, but 1 assessment covers the process. That's just my way of doing it - I think everyone has to do what suits their workplace. Heather
Admin  
#3 Posted : 29 June 2005 11:11:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By John Webster You cannot assess the substance without taking full account of the process. Its not so much what you've got as what you do with it that gives rise to risk of harm. I often cite the example of Acetic Acid. Do a CoSHH assessment on that, based purely on the MSDS, then show it to your local chip shop!! Conversely there are many substences not considered a health hazard which could prove fatal if used in a totally unexpected way - like drinking a bottle of washing up liquid.
Admin  
#4 Posted : 29 June 2005 11:19:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Alias I guess I kind of disagree with some of what has been written here. If a COSHH assessmrnt is done correctly it would take account of the manner and environment in which it was used. You can't just use the MSDS, you need to consider who, what, when where and why and until you have done that it doesn't qualify as a proper COSHH assessment in my eyes. Those two methods you describe are actually only one method done correctly which involves both elements. I do think you can do a COSHH assessment in a risk assessment format as to me COSHH is a RA involving said named substances, nothing more, nothing less :)
Admin  
#5 Posted : 29 June 2005 11:31:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Richard Chalkley Cards out on the table time... I employ a process oriented approach which aims to consider the context of use, quantity, synergies, routes of exposure, duration etc. I aim to take into account work equipment, TIIS etc. Basically when I am finished, the risk assessment should satisfy not just COSHH and be an easily digestible document with all the required info on context, procedures and control measures. I am not satisfied that 10 mins with the MSDS is at all applicable in my instance. Oh, and thanks for the chip shop analogy - If you don't mind I may just use that in the future. As another one, have you looked at the MSDS for water? It is a hoot. As are Acetone and Ethyl acetate (Nail varnish remover). Context, Context, Context. Richard.
Admin  
#6 Posted : 29 June 2005 13:27:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Lumpy No question .... process based. Do one all encompassing assessemnt for the process covering Manual Handling, Activity, PPE, COSHH etc. Reason as follows: Consider the following task: Decanting 25 litre drum of Acid into a vat. If you do one process based assessemnt you can covey the controls to the individual who does the work in one easy to read assessment. However if you do individual assessemnts (COSHH, Manual Handling etc), the poor operator will need to refer to several assessments, all cross referencing each other. No wonder the HSE suggerst that 80-90% of accidents are due to unsafe acts, there may be a safe system but the poor operator can't see the wood for the trees.
Admin  
#7 Posted : 30 June 2005 10:08:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Robert S Woods Shouldn’t a safe system of work, safe operating procedure that is understandable by the person who carries out the task be drawn up; using applicable risk assessments and other relevant materials? Employees other than union reps have no right to see risk assessments (I would have no problem showing them) but need to be informed of the hazards and controls in place. 10 points from the regs and guidance from where this gem came from.
Admin  
#8 Posted : 30 June 2005 14:39:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By MMoran The process, including the operator (pregnant, young person, etc) has got to be the main starting point. It may not be simple to do one all encompassing assessment. If you take a more complex task e.g. in a laboratory you may be performing an assay (experiment) that lasts a day, has thirty chemicals; uses radioisotopes; uses many pieces of equipment such as ultracentrifuges, ultra violet lights, hot plates; has lots of manual handling; use of computers oh and to make things difficult working with genetically modified organisms. I do not think that this would be an easy read. In addition the HSE require copies of class 2, 3 and 4 biological assessments for their files and also class 2, 3 and 4 GMO assessments for their files. If there is a risk assessment that leads on to further assessments that need to be done, or are done, this would be better in this scenario. There is no correct way and we have to evaluate the most suitable method of assessing. The main point is that they have to be suitable and sufficient. Michael
Admin  
#9 Posted : 30 June 2005 17:51:00(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Admin

Posted By Paul Leadbetter A COSHH assessment must be process based otherwise you are assessing the hazards of the substance rather than the risk of using it. Paul (an occupational hygienist as well as a safety advisor)
Users browsing this topic
Guest
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.