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#1 Posted : 08 September 2005 11:43:00(UTC)
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Posted By Smiff 'elf n' safety, innit! From http://www.thisisbournem...ournemouth/mainnews.html A DISTRICT nurse was due to meet bosses at Bournemouth Teaching Primary Care Trust on September 8 to find out if she can carry on covering her rounds by bicycle. Managers told Kathy Archer, who has been cycling between patients for a month, to get off her bike after discovering what she had been doing. The PCT only found out after a colleague whose car had broken down asked if she could follow Mrs Archer's example. The trust's director of clinical services, Anne Swan, told Nursing Standard magazine: "The area is high risk from drug users. "We are concerned that she is wandering around on a bicycle with needles and syringes in a bum bag. "I have to look at the needs of the patients and staff security." Mrs Archer, who lives in Bournemouth, was clocking up 15 miles a day, carrying medical supplies such as dressings and swabs in a rucksack. On days when she had to cover wider areas, she put the bike in the boot of the car and drove part of the way. She argues that she is saving the trust around £1,000 a year in fuel costs, cutting pollution and keeping fit. A spokesperson for the trust said: "We have received a request from one of our district nurses who wishes to do her rounds on a bicycle. "This person works for us in a temporary capacity as one of our bank nursing staff. "We have had an initial discussion with this nurse and there is a meeting planned when a decision on the way forward will be made. "A risk assessment is being carried out to assess the issues that would be faced by any district nurse doing rounds on a bicycle. "Such issues may include the amount of equipment that district nurses need to carry with them, as well as whether they might be working at night or in high risk areas. "The health and safety of our staff is paramount at all times. "We are hopeful that a mutually agreeable decision will be reached." Royal College of Nursing community health adviser Lynn Young said: "It is absolute nonsense to stop her using her bike. "Cycling is no more dangerous than walking around. "Nurses have to get out of their cars to see patients anyway." First published: September 8, 2005
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#2 Posted : 08 September 2005 12:00:00(UTC)
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Posted By J Knight I'm a cyclist (two reasons for not quite seeing eye to eye with mr Clarke:)) so I am biased, but once again this seems to be a decision, if true, which cites risk without actually considering risk at all. Some 750 - 1000 workers are killed on the UKs roads each year (there are no precise figures due to weaknesses in RIDDOR95), but managers never think to stop their workers from driving; put people on a pushbike and, suddenly we can't do enough for their safety. Pah! My partner is a physio, and whenever possible she does her work by bike (though of course she can't carry zimmer frames) without a murmur from her managers. This could be different perspectives from physios in management (physios tend to be active sporty types) versus nurses in management (nurses don't tend to be active sporty types). However, this is a report in the media, written by a journo, and one has to wonder whether there's a back-story here which the reporter has been too lazy to uncover? Maybe there are performance issues and her managers believe that cycling is slower than driving (though in urban areas it certainly isn't)? Or something else, but if we can take this story on face value there is every reason why she should be on her bike and none why she shouldn't, John
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#3 Posted : 08 September 2005 12:04:00(UTC)
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Posted By J Knight Clarkson! Not Clarke, Clarkson! (Distracted by work, in this case still trying to read the Event Safety Guide - it says we need COSHH assessments for soap, which I'm dead sure we don't, but that's another story) John
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#4 Posted : 08 September 2005 12:47:00(UTC)
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Posted By Frank Hallett Nice response John! Clarke/Clarkson? I actually didn't see any anomoly there at all; depends on the readers perspective dunnit? Incidentally, who would we use an example if we couldn't use our beloved Jeremy? His name has become synonymous with the concepts of extremist risk taking v extremist risk management. OK, back to the HSE's initiative to promote "sensible risk mangement" v local interpretation of "sensible" and the "improved relationship" between the HSe and local enforcers!!! No, I'm not pre-judging anything here; there simply isn't sufficient information to provide a balanced comment. But the one thing that the HSE don't do is provide any valid guidance on what they mean by "sensible"; so it actually leaves the employer with no firmer foundation on which to base their interpretation of acceptable risk than before. I shall ceretainly look for any follow-up on this one though - it should provide a really good case study. Frank Hallett
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#5 Posted : 09 September 2005 10:31:00(UTC)
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Posted By Andy Petrie I'm sure drug users have nothing better to do all day than chase round after cyclists with rucksacks on the off chance that they may have a needle. (assuming they are in a state to even stand up) I think in reality they would either go to their local needle exchange or just run the dirty one under the tap.
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#6 Posted : 09 September 2005 11:45:00(UTC)
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Posted By Alan Haynes I smell the early stages of an outbreak of 'bonkers conkers'
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#7 Posted : 09 September 2005 11:52:00(UTC)
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Posted By jackw. Hi, surprissed at the manager/trusts response. but as has been said we don't have al the facts to judge and performance may be an issue. for example my LA actually pays milage to staff using a bicycle moststaff area based thus don't have to travel across the whole of the LA..but on the other hand as i cover the whole of the LA they would not let me use a bicycle for 40 mile round trips. So i guess the old fav "comon sense" comes into play.. ah if only it was that simple!!! cheers
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#8 Posted : 09 September 2005 12:35:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ashley Williams What about PPE for doing all this on a bike? Does she wear head protection in case she falls off after all under the new working a heights regs she needs assessing. Does she wear goggles for impact with fast flying insects. Oh and some form of mask to filterout all the dust and gas not to mention VOC's in the air, thats just in houses never mind on the roads. Shes bound to need gloves in case she needs to hold on tightly going down hill and footwear just incase she drops the bike on her foot. Did i miss anything? Ash
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#9 Posted : 09 September 2005 13:27:00(UTC)
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Posted By steve williamson Howdy, I'd be a bit worried if she was in a hospital, but I suspect if she can do it on a bike her powers that be are afraid their mileage claims may be queried! Cheers, Stevew
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#10 Posted : 09 September 2005 14:12:00(UTC)
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Posted By Andy Petrie Ash, what about vibration from cobbled streets
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#11 Posted : 09 September 2005 14:38:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Webster Its the conkers, of course. If she works in an LA area where they have not yet cut down the conker trees, she will be at risk of being tipped over the handlebars if her front wheel were to strike a fallen conker.
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#12 Posted : 09 September 2005 15:38:00(UTC)
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Posted By Paul Oliver COSHH assessment for Soap. Don't eat it it.
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#13 Posted : 09 September 2005 16:31:00(UTC)
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Posted By Arran Linton - Smith I have just finished and Environmental MSc dissertation on urban and commuter cycling and can I add some quick facts regarding the risk of cycling. 1. The more cyclists there are our roads the safer cycling is. For example in the UK we cycle an average of 0.1 kilometres per person per day against 1.7 in Denmark and 3.0 in the Netherlands. In the UK there are 6 Cyclist Killed per 100 million kilometres; however that number is 2.3 in Denmark and 1.6 in the Netherlands. 2. The level of risk in terms of a cycling fatality also needs to be balanced against the potential gain in terms of life years. Analysis by the British Medical Association (BMA) have shown even that even in a hostile cycling environment such as in Britain, the benefits gained from regular cycling in terms of life years gained, outweighed the loss of life in cycling fatalities. (Hillman M 1994 Cycling towards health and safety) has calculated this to be a ratio of 20 years gained to one year lost. 3. Three in every four people in the UK population aren't active enough to protect themselves against illness such as heart disease, stroke, diabetes and some cancers. A regular cyclist enjoys a level of fitness of someone ten years younger than themselves, and has a life expectancy of two years above the average. 4. Cyclist using a road-side cycle path are nearly 2.5 times likely to be injured than if they were cycling on the carriageway with other road users. Pasenen E, Helsinki City Planning Department (accessed Aug 2005) The Risks of Cycling http://www.bikexprt.com/...rch/pasanen/helsinki.htm
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#14 Posted : 09 September 2005 16:38:00(UTC)
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Posted By Frank Hallett Arran, I am truly and deeply impressed. Perhaps the District Nurse in question should have a copy of your dissertation. Incidentally, do you cycle? Frank Hallett
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#15 Posted : 09 September 2005 16:57:00(UTC)
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Posted By Arran Linton - Smith Frank, Yes I do cycle and to celebrate completing the dissertation, I am off on my bike to the Himalayas for three weeks. The safety element of my dissertation had to be kept short because it was an environmental management degree. Arran
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#16 Posted : 09 September 2005 17:11:00(UTC)
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Posted By Merv Newman Arran, in my experience you will encounter few, if any yetis below the snowline. But please wear a helmet just in case one does recognise who and what you are. I understand they can be over affectionate (hearsay) Merv
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#17 Posted : 10 September 2005 14:10:00(UTC)
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Posted By DougieGeorge Going back to the junkies chasing the nurse on the bike, I smell a conspiracy here! Some health authority worker has been given some unachievable target for the year to make junkies fitter or run further. He has hit on a brilliant plan by inventing & disseminating the story of the syringe carrying cyclist nurse. This is really a subversive plot to get junkies fitter. Next time I see a junkie chasing a cyclist, I know that this imaginative health campaign has worked!
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#18 Posted : 10 September 2005 20:01:00(UTC)
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Posted By angela westwood riding along on my push bike honey.... I though "improving working lives" was trying to get more people to cycle rather than in the car
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#19 Posted : 12 September 2005 16:28:00(UTC)
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Posted By steve e ashton Being a lazy s.o.b. most of the time, I've always avoided cycling because of the steep gradients. But in this case... if there are a lot of drug users, presumably there are plenty of pushers as well. So the nurse will have help for the steep bits? Sorry, couldn't resist it... It seems to be early days for anyone here to be ridiculing the Trust/Authority. I'm certain we would all hope our employers would 'risk assess' any proposed change of work practices - and that is what this health (Board/Trust) is doing isn't it? They haven't reached any conclusion yet, so we shouldn't be assuming (as the Journo wants us to) that they will 'ban' cycling. We should be applauding the management for their pro-active stance - how many organisations have only documented some risk assessments after the fact, despite Regs that require assessment before the activity starts? Steve ps I once chased a rabbit round a field on a bike - 16 speed derailleur, chrome moly frame etc etc... I don't know how a bunny could afford such an expensive bike but boy could it pedal.... (Sorry again)
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