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Posted By Raymond Rapp
A friend of mine recently had a minor operation and when she returned to work she was informed that she will not be paid any sick pay. She does not have a contract of employment, but has been an employee for couple of years.
As a minimum is she entitled to statuory sick pay? Any other advice would be appreciated. Many thanks.
Ray
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Posted By MSE
Sorry, but you need an HR opinion for this one. Was the need for medical intervention due to work? If not, what's your main concern?
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Posted By Linda Crossland-Clarke
Hi
I would have thought she would get SSP after 3 (or is it 5 days absence?). In any case, not having a employment contract (terms and conditions) means the company is operating illegally. Try ACAS, they will tell you exactly where she stands.
regards
Linda
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Posted By Lilian McCartney
The citizens Advice people will help in advising what the entitlements are.
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Posted By The toecap
I beg to differ slightly. There is a contract. If there wasn't how would she get paid and why turn out for work. This is an implied terms contract. In that she has been giving something and getting paid in return. An employment contract need not be in writing. However, now that its come to this she is entitled to ask for a written contract to see what her entitlements are. And she must be given this in writing. If a refusal, you can then apply to an employment tribunal for this. All to often employees arent requesting written contracts. I think this should be the norm'. This way both parties know where they stand in cases such as this.
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Posted By Crim
Employee may not be entitled to SSP for a number of reasons, but what employer has to do is confirm why this is on the SSP1 which is in two parts, one part for employee to make claim the other which the employer completes, this can the be used to make a claim with DWP who look at recent National Insurance contributions usually last two tax years (03/04 & 05/06)to see if person qualifies benefit, if they do not qualify benefit they should get national insurance credits whilst they remain unfit for work and the credits do allow person to claim income support if they have no other income. DWP will investigate cases where employers do not give reason for being unable to pay SSP or who refuse to complete their part of form.
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Posted By gham
the lack of a written contract means nowt the contract is implied because she goes to work and gets paid for it. She should have received a statement of particluars of employment within a certain number of weeks (can't remember how many) have a look at the DTI emplyment matters/relations website and ACAS.
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Posted By Is Kismet
It always surprises me that so many people (on this H&S forum) will answer questions/give an opinion which is outside the H&S remit.
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Posted By Ron Hunter
Why surprised Is Kismet? Many of us with H&S remit have others as well!
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Posted By Is Kismet
Because it is a H&S forum!
If it was named 'painting and decorating' I would expect people to answer questions about painting and decorating, not vehicle repairs - understand?
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Posted By Crim
Isn't it a good thing that so many people know so much about such a variety of issues. I thought that is the reason for this chat site's existance.
Don't be surprised but do be amazed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Posted By Is Kismet
Thinks >>>>
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Posted By Ron Hunter
And the great thing about this site is that we can include discussion about painting and decorating, motor vehicle repairs, nuclear physics and brain surgery.........you name it. This 'Is Kismet' is how we learn NEW things!
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Posted By Is Kismet
And 'Ron Hunter', why we should take a lot of what is said with a pinch of salt!
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Posted By gham
It's all relevant
This is an employment issue, Your either and employer or and employee and need to know these things. if you don't know them it could cause you stress, which we all know MAY BE health and safety issue if caused at work and because this is work related then it's relevant
It's called pooling your resources, this forum is used by many wise persons
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Posted By The toecap
The best safety people, i believe, are those that have a varying and wide range of knowledge and experiences. I also believe that these are generally the best people. This is merely my own humble opinion.
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Posted By Is Kismet
See Ray, I told you my topic was more interesting than yours.
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Posted By Merv Newman
I'm not sure. Can anyone tell me if this thread has been hijacked ?
If you are a "pure" H&S person then it helps to avoid what are properly HR issues. And distinguish between them.
And who says painting and decorating does not have H&S issues ? You ask my dad (a P&D er by trade) who always came home with paint in his hair.
I really do like the way this forum wanders from subject to subject. And most of it is relevant to H&S in some way.
It's a learning experience. (LE = similar to a snafu but more refined)
Home-made Paté en crout tonight. With due respect of HACCP within available resources.
Merv
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Posted By Mat
Typical H & S responses, what is the phrase,
'Jack of all trades - Master of none'
say it all i think.
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Posted By Linda Crossland-Clarke
Hi folks
We all like to help each other out - it's a "chat" forum.
Mod's is there any possibility that we could have another forum that is just general chat? After all we can't help but socialise with people of similar interests. OK, this is well and truely high jacked now.
Regards
Linda
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Posted By Saracen11
Hi Raymond and others... you know who you are!!!
Painters and decorators work at height - that my friends is called "A link to elf n safety..."
Regards
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Posted By John Murgatroyd
Not only is the employee entitled to SSP (which she can apply for herself to the DWP) but also to holiday pay. Due to the lack of a written contract her holiday pay is an average of the 13 weeks pay preceding her holiday (working time directive)
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Posted By Raymond Rapp
Many thanks to those who have taken the time and trouble to give some relevant advice. I deliberately kept the posting simple in order to extract a diverse range of opinions. I certainly got that!!!!!!!
I am only being a 'good samaritan' and I have a reasonable knowledge in this area (that's why I was asked for advice), however, I am more familar with those matters arising from a contract.
As others have pointed out, there is often not a clear distinction between h&s matters and other forms on work related interests. Anyway, it does not hurt to broaden one's horizons.
Kind regards
Ray
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Posted By Saracen11
Hi Raymond, just to wish your friend a speedy recovery.
Kind regards
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Posted By JF
Well said Merv.
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Posted By Mick Day
OH DEAR - OH DEAR - OH DEAR........!
Some of you replying to this thread are very very very out of touch.
The matter of Contract Law & Employment Law is covered in depth on the Level 6 Diploma.
This does not mean those of us who have studied it are experts, bur I can assure you we know more in this subject than a lot of HR people, who only several months ago I was spending considerable time advising on employees contracts to the HR Manager.
It also gives us some degree of remit to comment.
Mat, keen to know what your relevant field of expertise is in, as reading your reply it is not H & S.......?
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Posted By Crim
Well Mick, don't just let us know how smart you are why not answer the question?
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Posted By Mick Day
Have been sat patiently waiting for someone to ask..............!
Not a smart Alec, merely stating a fact that some are not aware of what gets taught ........!
The answer is as with all issues and subject like this.......!
Only those who sit on Magistrates / Tribunals with all the facts and having been able to ask relevant questions and understand the individual case can decide....., surely you know that......?
From the very lttle bit of info given , the fact that the person concerned has worked for some time, has been paid implies a contract. Contracts do not have to be in writing ( Although I am sure you know it would be better to have it in Writing.........? )
So my dear responder, I am not that Smart to give a ruling that can be definate cause I aint a Judge / Magistrate / Head of a Tribunal.....but you knew that .......?
So if you want the answer to this or indeed any other decision on any H & S issue..........Ask the Magistrate / Judge / Head of Tribunal what the decision is......... because they will know that.....!
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Posted By Crim
Mick,
It's people like you that give us safety professionals a bad name!
Why can't you just answer the question and help out a fellow safety professional.
Or is it because you do not know how to answer the question?
If you look up the list of responses you will find the correct advice already given, from myself a mere NVQ 4 CMIOSH.
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Posted By Saracen11
Hi Raymond,
Mick, so in other words... you don't know.
Thanks for your contribution... The 'answers' you've provided have already been given.
Regards
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Posted By Mick Day
CRIM,
For someone who has CMIOSH by answering Smart Alec does not give us much hope.
The answer was directed at you.....! and the manner in how it was written.........!
But you knew that did'nt you...................!
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Posted By Crim
Mick,
Its getting too personal now and late as well. Not very professional of you.
Goodnight all
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Posted By Saracen11
MODERATORS MESSAGE...
This thread has now been locked due to the foreseeable levels of sarcasm that will follow... Can the Mod team please remind all users of the forum not to get personal no matter how much bait is laid for them. Remember Guys (girls and gender confused) this is a professional discussion site used to discuss health and safety issues, not for members to talk about the sizes of their massive heads.
Ta very much!
Saracen11 (ex) boy scout and apple bobbing champion on our street 1975.
regards
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Posted By Arran Linton - Smith
As a result of this thread being hijacked and an apparent number of breaches of the Acceptable Use Guidelines, rather than locking this thread and hiding many (including innocent) messages, this thread has been returned to the last message posted 29th August @ 12.04
Arran Linton – Smith
IOSH Moderator
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