Posted By B We provide support to adults with learning disabilities in their own homes. Usually these homes are rented by these people from housing associations. When the asbestos legislation came into force in 2004 it was decided (by my predecessor) that although the houses are ‘technically’ places of work for our employees they are domestic residences and we therefore do not have to test for asbestos (in the same way as you would not have to test as a domestic cleaner etc in someone’s private home). Any maintenance of the houses should be completed by the housing association under the terms of the tenancy agreement. Recently a housing association has tested one of the houses in which we support people for asbestos and presented us with a bill for half of the cost as we work there as well. At the moment we are refusing to pay it as we consider the house to be domestic. So basically my questions are: Are these houses considered to be domestic or non-domestic premises? If they are non-domestic is it permissible to commission joint reports between the housing association and ourselves or would we need to do testing independently? I have read the Control of Asbestos at Work Regs from cover to cover, as well as any guidance I can get my hands on but have not been able to find an answer yet. Has anybody else had this problem? Please help! Thanks everyone.

Posted By Dave Wilson Go to this and you will get a definative answer http://www.hse.gov.uk/asbestos/campaign/chart.htm

Posted By Ken Taylor (a) They sound domestic to me. (b) They seem to be no more your workplace than that of a home help, district nurse or Bob's meter reader. I would reject the charge. It would, however, be of interest to know whether your clients are at undue risk from exposed asbestos. Surveys in a sample of typical residences can be a reasonable measure in this respect.

Posted By Dave Wilson Slightly wrong steve persons in control of non - domestic premises and common parts of domestic premises have a duty to find out whether there is Asbestos in their premises and in what condition, They then have a duty to manage that and inform anyone who may be affected by the ACM, this could be tennants, FM, maintenance staff builders It / CCTV etc etc These groups of workers then have a duty to ensure that they do not allow their employees to work on the building until they know wheter the area they are working on does or does'nt contain Asbestos which could affect them. Domestic premises are defined for the purposes of Reg 4 CAW by the HSE on the link above

Posted By Salus Hi B, The HA is carrying out the survey because their maintenace teams have to carry out work in the properties, so they want to know where if any,asbestos containing materials are. It would be silly to carry out two different surveys but I would like to see the results, so this is not necessary. you are not working on/in or with asbestos so you do not have that duty of care, do nothing but reject the the HA proposals that your employer should share costs for any survey carried out.

Posted By Malcolm Greenhouse I have read through the postings and followed the link to the HSE site. I have therefore drawn the following conclusion. The regulations re a management plan do not apply to domestic premises unless it is the common areas. In this case it will be either the joint tenants, the landlord or a mixture of both who are responsible for drawing up a management plan. However the following is not clear. Working for a Social Landlord we have 6000 properties that by the above criteria would not require a management plan. There is however every likelihood of asbestos being present in the properties either introduced by tenants, (Artex, fire boards behind gas fires etc.)or as part of the original construction, (bath panels, rainwater products) What aspect of law covers working on these products in a domestic setting. Is it the overall duty of care? An insights greatly appreciated.

Posted By Sally Bell For what it's worth, I manage a sheltered Almshouse Service consisting of independent flats within a purpose built building. We have been advised that we have a duty to manage and survey the communal parts of the building (and office for example), but that we do not have a 'duty' to do the same with the actual flats. However, as a matter of good practice, we have actually surveyed all the buildings (including the 'domestic' areas), and of course established that the whole set up is riddled with asbestos. As a result we have put into practice the following management procedures: 1. All people undertaking work in the properties are required to inspect and sign the asbestos log and are also required to work safely (regardless on who is employing them - e.g. family putting up shelves etc.) - this is a part of the license to occupy agreement that our residents sign 2. As a property is voided we remove the asbestos as a part of the void (obviously using an asbestos removal company), and in many cases take advantage of this factor to comply with Decent Homes req. in replacing the kitchens and bathrooms. For an organisation with a large number of properties this may be very difficult but as i understand it at some point the asbestos is likely to become unsafe and regardless of who's responsibility it may be, someone will have to address the problem - better to do something now than later! Finally, though we are unable to access it due to our particular circumstances i am sure that there is funding available somewhere to undertake this kind of work - if not why not? With regards to the original question, i would expect the landlord to be responsible for payment - would they pass the charge to a tenant under normal circumstances (e.g. a social housing tenant)?