Posted By Dar Morning All I need a little advise/guidance if at all possible. I work for a company that have service engineers who have to enter private dwellings and repair/replace fault electric showers and thermostatic showers, to do this the engineer may have to enter the loft space to isolate electric and water supplies. We have concerns getting to these supplies firstly we have provided the engineers with ladders to enter the loft space, so this is not to much of a problem but once they have access 95% of lofts are not boarded out causing me a concern both from a safety point of view and a insurance point of view. I would love to tell the engineer to walk away or get the householder to isolate these supplies but this is not always possible when the householders is elderly. Is there any advise out there ?. Kind regards Dar

Posted By Chris Jerman And returning to the real world for a second.. Entering a loft space is not the same as being in the void as the house is being constructed where you could potentially fall to your death. Sure, slipping between the joists is going to be nasty, but not as nasty as the car crash that the engineer could have whilst driving to the appointment! So these things have to be seen in context. That's the purpose of assessment. The likelihood of slipping may of course be greater than the potential to have a car crash as well as the extent of the injury being less. Either way by my calculation it's not the end of the world. So what can you do? Well the previous suggestions are sensible - isolate remotely where possible. But where this isn't possible, your company has to decide at the highest level what it wants to do. You CANNOT simply leave the choice down to the discretion of the engineer. However, it is inevitable that at some point an engineer will face the position where they are required to cross un-boarded joists. You really need to equip them with the tools to assess the situation - lighting, distance, headroom, clutter etc all add up to the final decision. Remember that the purpose of legislation is not to stop people running a business, but to make sure that they run a business that thinks about what it does, why it does it and the benefit to be gained from doing it. Making good decisions based on clear rationale is the idea. It doesn't mean that nothing will ever go wrong. Engineers MUST be empowered to say 'no' and feel OK about it. It may be that you have to go back again armed with some crawling boards etc - but fixing a shower at any costs? Well, it's not an argument that stacks up is it? Part of this must start with the initial contact with the customer when they make the call to you. It's about managing their disappointment I guess. In the end - there's no magic solution, except to say no at which point we may as well all pack up and go home.

Posted By Chris Jerman Sorry Dar, not having bad day - think you have wrong end of stick my friend. I take safety very seriously too. I was reflecting that saying that you don't have to go in lofts to isolate was a bit idealistic. So unless you say that you won't - ever, you're going to have to tolerate a degree of risk associated with the activity, just like you do with the driving to the appointment. It's all a balance. Once you've done all that you can reasonably do, you have to live with it. I suspect that even if your company said no to loft access, your guys would still do it, because that have a desire to get the job done. Better to be honest about it and do it well - or as well as you can. Sorry if my post conveyed a different sentiment. C

Posted By The toecap When i can find it \:

Posted By Mark Ellis Hello all, nothing is ever easy. An electrician college of mine was disconnecting/removing wiring from a Major builders show house, he stepped between the tusses an fell through the plasterboard ceiling landing on his backside,resulting in serious spinal injury. he was in hospital for six months-three of them on his back. He worked and still does for a reputable contractor who has since carried out and implemented thorough risk assessment, specifically reduced/stopped "loft work". You must remember most house now have two layers of insulation,one parallel between the trusses and one across the top, making it very difficult to walk on the timber truss. PS he is in the process of suing his employer.

Posted By Mark Ellis Hello Dar, sorry can't help you there,if I were in your position I would do the R/A myself and present it to your employer. Mark.