Posted By Doug Kelly Try BS6187:2000 and http://www.safetyindesign.org/DEMOLITION.pdf CDM will apply

Posted By Peter MacDonald BS 6187 is a good starting point along with the associated guidance notes. If asbestos is present check out the HSE website relating to what can and cannot be done without notification and employment of a licensed contractor. You will need to have or commission a type three survey before any demoliton work is carried out. CDM will apply only if the criteria for an F10 notification is met and that will depend on the size of the job. BS 6187 only really makes sense if you're experienced in demolition though but I often have CDM coordinators (planning supervisors as they were previously) use it as a template for making sure the basics are in place. If you have any specifics you need answering drop me an e-mail. I'm a Contract Manager for a demolition contrcator. Regards Peter

Posted By Doug Kelly CDM applies to all construction projects, with specific additional 'arrangements' for notifiable work.

Posted By Nick Wilson1 Anyone got a pdf copy of BS6187?

Posted By Robert K Lewis Doug Wish it was and then one could almost make sense of it. What really troubles me is that a very well known name has produced this report and it certainly is not a typo. You then find that they think they can presume anything but crocidolite!! It is companies like this that give the asbestos surveying sector a bad name and pose people such as myself with a problem explaining to clients that it is a virtual waste of money. The whole point I think I am trying to make is that asbestos surveys are a closely regulated sector and they "round the corners out" so to speak - so what is one to make of other contaminant surveys such as lead, solvents etc etc. I really advise all contractors and clients that such surveys now are only indicative when we should be able to rely on the surveyor and their ability to undertake and record their activities accurately. After all if I have a survey report on a structure condition for purchase I would generally get a detailed quality report covering many items and telling me precisely what was and what was not looked at. Bob

Posted By peter gotch Hi Nick, think FJ's message meant for you! Regards, Peter

Posted By Doug Kelly Bob You're quite right to be concerned about a leading player in the field producing inconsistent/inconclusive/confusing advice - the report type is totally anomalous and probably meaningless (??). (I would be interested to learn the identity of the publisher, just out of professional curiosity - not for the sake of tittle- tattle that isn't useful to anyone). As with any field of expertise, there is a variation in quality, which hopefully things like UKAS accreditation or other QA systems should iron out. (In my experience biggest or most well known or most highly qualified doesn't always indicate 'best'. During the 'boom' years for asbestos surveying, virtually anyone was being dragged off the streets to become a surveyor - armed with a P402 of course and figuratively speaking!). Incidentally, have you brought your concerns regarding the report to the attention of the survey company? I'm sure they would welcome the opportunity to rectify the issues you raise. (You may have guessed I was formerly involved in this type of activity). I agree you should be able to rely on the veracity of a report from competent organisations, especially when findings can have huge impact on H & S and £/p further down the line. My own view on the 'presumption' bit is that you can indicate fibre type for certain materials, say fire blankets, AC sheeting and AIB (as long as the surveyor has experience of what these materials look like with/without crocidolite), but where there is residual uncertainty, to then presume crocidolite (as per MDHS100 Para 36 and Table 1) Regards

Posted By Doug Kelly Bob It's still possible to be confident with the necessary past - those who only have experience of surveys are unlikely to be in this position, but if you've undertaken enough bulk analysis...... Cheers Doug