Posted By Andrew Cartridge
Being an avid forum reader & sometimes contributor, I would ask my learned colleagues this. In your opinion, what is it that contributes most to your daily roles (Merv that’s roles not rolls ;-) )

Is it your hard fought for & won qualifications, or is it your many years of industry experience? Or is it a balance of both. The reason for this question is, that our profession by its very nature is focussed on who has what letters after their name.

Whilst I accept that legislation requires this, & rightly so, is the profession missing out on the greatly experienced but less qualified advisors, who, for their own reasons do not want to join our “happy band” should we have “Grandad Rights” perhaps? Have a good weekend.


Andy

Posted By Adrian Watson
Dear Andrew,

The simple answer is that both qualifications and experience are required.

You need the underpinning knowledge and the experience of the practical application of the knowledge.

Formal qualifications of all kinds and at all levels demonstrate that the individual has a knowledge that has been examined by a third party to a set standard.

I do not agree with grandfather rights and believe that all people wishing to access IOSH should have an open book exam regardless of other qualifications to test the practical application of the knowledge and have a refresher exam every 5 years.

Regards Adrian

Posted By Andrew Meiklejohn
Ah this old chestnut...

When looking at qualifications and experience I think it is important to remember that they may not necessarily be good things.

Qualifications, are evidence of competence, and experience is practice of putting that competence into practice.

However, it is possible for people to recieve a poor standard of training.

It is also possible for people to get bad experience.

What i am trying to say is I would rather have an employee, in any role, not just safety, who was intelligent and logical.
Than someone with just experience or qualifications.

Posted By Pete48
Well I suppose it is Friday. They are different things that complement each other. Since the world moves on evry day, qualifications are only a snapshot of an ability at the time they are gained. Thus, if I have a honours degree attained in 1959 what does that tell you about me in 2007. (apart from the fact that I might be old!!)
Experience is always a current asset. Thus, if I have worked for thirty years I have gained further knowledge from hopefully a mixture of hands on, maybe in several areas of industry, and further study of new developments (CPD).
So the two balance themselves dependant on where you are in your own development. In the 21st century, qualifications are increasingly required to open the door to then gain the experience but that is all they do. If you cannot apply the information learnt during study then your study is worthless.
The employer chooses the balance they require for the job they have.
To answer your original question. When first starting out on my H&S career, I relied upon my qualifications quite heavily, these days it is my experience that attracts employers and that I use most.

Posted By DP
Andy,

Has to be experience every time.

There is no qualification in any field of employment that helps you deal with people and getting across to people is what we have to do every day in this game.

H&S qualifications are only appreciated amongst ourselves, as I suppose with qualifications in any other profession.

You would hardly find the Diploma vs NVQ argument in the pub on Saturday night would you? Just on this forum.

DP

Posted By Raymond Rapp
Andrew, I agree with most of the views on this thread, in that these days you need both experience and qualifications to succeed. If you look at the h&s job adverts (back of SHP) it will provide a good benchmark.

Having said that, it will also depend on the individual as well. I know many very competent practitioners who have fairly basic qualifications. It does not affect them in their everyday role. For me personally, I feel experience is the most important - you can't get a degree in it!

Ray

Posted By Bob Youel

whilst I stated experience was number 1; I was not saying that academic qualifications are not important. I feel that without the two together competence and respect will never be achieved

You need to wrap many elements together; including such things as confidence [as noted above], the ability to sell and market yourself and the profession, knowledge of other areas e.g. accounting, social security, insurance, commercial and contract law etc [shall I continue?]

It still surprises me that many senior practitioners have no accounting, commercial / contractual qualifications and experience

Posted By JasonGould
I am kinda with Tony.

In fact I am getting little tired of this competence stuff now and am seeing it almost becoming like the H&S inferiority complex.

You can have both experience and quals but you may be a right Lazy Git whom just wants the fast road and fast bucks without the work. They are out there as we all know.


For others like me whom are pretty new to the experience side of things, I say this:-

"Just stay willing, persistent and work hard always considering how you can sell H&S without having to resort to too much law quoting".

There is times when law quoting will be required but selling it via other ways seem to make it work much better and longer IMHO.

I started out trying to help everyone, it is however a bit sad that some will take advantages out of your techniques and that is when you have to try another approach i.e. be a bit more damming/assertive in the reports and discussions you have (do your homework beforehand).

One things I am beginning to learn is that all contractors/companies are your best friends on day one and they all state they are trying to improve/willing etc, then you notice that simple changes become a damn mission to get them to do and then you start getting every excuse in the book etc. This is the time to step back and reevaluate you tact (Mr helpful is not working here).

H&S does seem to benefit from the helpers and the screamers. One cannot really only do one method.

As for quals, I don't tend to look at that side of the coin as I did OK after some hard work but at the same time, I continually meet people whom although appear to be less qualified, are far better than me.

Jason Gould Grad Iosh, MIIRSM, Dip2OSH, D.y.s.l.e.x.i.c, C.o.m.m.o.n, B.a.l.d.y, n.u.t.c.a.s.e, g.e.e.k.

Posted By Emamode
Dear Andrew,

Very often, and always, we refer to certain positions in our HSE MS as critical positions- these positions include HSE.

Persons who fill these positions are required to be competent. The question is, what makes a person to be competent? Three elements define competence- Education (Your qualification, Experience and Training (coaching, mentoring, etc).

You see, both qualification and experience (including training which is a function of experience) are key. They cannot be seperated.

HSE involes alot of studies, analysis, communication. Experience has shown that HSE professionals who do not have good education struggle to deliver.


Don