Posted By anthony mills
I hear various contractors going on about how method statements need to be simple. However one particular contractor who we are currently working for is demanding a method statement which resembles the yellow pages in thickness. Is there any acop or guidance from the hse that states that method statements must be simple, as some of the items we are being asked for are just ridiculous.

any help would be appreciated

Regards

Anthony Mills

Posted By Chris Pope
Agreed. Boffin itus seems to be spreading.

Try this as an example of what HSE state should be in a roofwork method statement http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/ais32.pdf

Posted By Arran Linton - Smith
It simply sounds as though your client does not understands what the objective of a method statement should be.

To me it is simply a description on how the task is to be safely undertaken.

I also use these as an audit tool when I see an unsafe task being undertaken.

Posted By Robert K Lewis
If you cannot remember all the detail in the MS why should an operative busy trying to earn a living?

If it is longer than 2 pages then it needs breaking downinto accceptabe chunks. The HSE have some inspectors who are very keen to reduce MS complexity.

Bob

Posted By Gerry Marchant
The problem is the contractor asking for reams of paperwork maybe doesn't understand the whole concept of H&S....papewrwork does not save lifes...only the relvant bits and as somebody has already stated 2 pages is quite sufficient for a process that Anthony is describing...the people who ask for folders full of useless info are the ones giving H&S a bad name at present!!!!

Posted By GARRY WIZZ
H&S is a two way street.

When I start to recieve requests for the 500 pager as to how we will operate safely.


In the interests of said safety I reply in the first instance requesting a 500 pager on how they will provide a safe environment for my workers on thier site.

We then chat on the phone, we then exchange exchange information on a sensible level.

Garry

Posted By CFT
Gary

Your exaggerating surely???? no one asks for anything more than 400 pages these days!!!

CFT

Posted By CFT
Bob

I don't think the old PS had anything to do with it; where I think the demand for an over complicated SSOW stems from, is over zealous inexperienced people trying to satisfy their own complex egotistical attitude towards OHS.

Thoughts.

Many don't even have a clue of what they are looking at, especially when it comes to the safety content, the MS has been taken on by industry to include what how when why, without considering the full H&S implications of the work which is why in part, we have seen an increase in fatalities and serious incidents outside the full scope of construction work and it is post construction that should be taking far more care in how it looks after the workforce and contractors.

Construction takes enough of a pounding, unjustly so IMO, it is the after market maintenance both commercial and domestic that needs to up its level of commitment to keeping people safe and healthy and to stop cutting corners; proposed changes to the way enforcement is to be allowed to inspect don't help one bit, and I fear that the SSOW is one of the most misunderstood areas in general maintenance per se.

Sorry Anthony to have wandered a bit of track from the original post but it's an area I am passionate about.

The contractors used throughout our Group (and there are many of them) often supply a package at the pr-amble stage and frequently quote every piece of legislation going, (or they used to anyway)often stating the wrong years, the wrong regulations and worst of all quoting such areas as the FPA 1971 etc when clearly the RRFSO should be mentioned when appropriate to do so; after meeting with all and re-assessing every single one of them a much simpler system is now in place; Google is NOT the way to get technical information.

It took some administrative time to complete but now it works well and takes an entirely simplistic and sensible approach; oh to be fair on occasions it is complex but then there will be a reason, it is complex work and a thorough package should be made available.

Industry varies greatly and what is going to be suitable in one clearly won't 'cut the mustard' in another, but that is where enjoying the services of a competent person who is responsible for accepting the MS pays off; it is when someone who does not understand what is required takes a 'scatter gun' approach and eventually covers every single item. Yes I did see once on a MS how the tea would be made!!!

Charley (clearly a Monday and not quite at peace with himself yet)

Posted By Robert K Lewis
A risk assessemnt and associated methods of control are however required by law where the risk is significant - You can demand this.

Bob