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Posted By Chris Bridle
We know as employers that we cannot charge for any PPE equipment provided to enable employee's to carry out their job safely whilst in our employment. So what if a frequent offender will not wear safety glasses and keeps because he keeps loosing them? If disciplinary procedures have failed is there a point when we can refuse to provide Safety glasses or charge the individual for his equipment?
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Posted By DKH
Chris, if you refuse to provide Safety glasses are you not saying that there isn't a need for them ?
have you tried sitting down with this person to identify any possible underlying issues? & fully explained the need to wear safety glasses
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Posted By Mark Bywater
If as, the previous contributor suggests, you sit him down and find there to be no problem with the equipment, he is breaking the law.
As such should be taken through disciplinary procedures until he is finally sacked or complies.
It's up to him really.
Susequently there may be a problem with the glasses which you must sort out.
Thanks,
Mark
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Posted By Geoff Parkinson
I'd be reviewing your discipline procedures. Surely, the ultimate result of following the procedure would be dismissal of the individual! Or, doesn't your company view failure to comply with company rules (which enable to help the company comply with statute law and regulation) as serious?
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Posted By Garry Homer
You have a legal duty to sort him out and not to cave in and he has a legal duty to wear it.
His actions will undermine all health and safety in your company very quickly.
Beef up the disciplinary procedures until it hurts, by making it a serious matter that can result in loss of employment. If the threat does not work then he should be sacked.
I would be similarly penalised if I turned up at a site without the appropriate PPE that had been provided specifically for that work.
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Posted By Keith Radcliffe
Hi Chris,
Without going into chapter and verse of H&S at Work etc act, an employee has an obligation to not recklessly interfere or tamper with work equipment etc etc, which this clear falls into? so you should enforce the discipline side and make it work to your company procedures, eg verbal, written etc, which may mean suspending them on nil pay etc or terminating their contract.
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Posted By Chris Bridle
Thank you all for your time. Yes I will be taking a tougher stance on this. I will have to admit to being too compassionate, trying different types of glasses for the individual.
Thanks again One & All
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Posted By osazemen
It is still the duty of the employer to provide and enforce the use of PPE whether the employee refuses to use it or not. The bottom line is that the employer has to find out why the employee is not making use of the PPE before taking any disciplinary action.
The employer has to make sure the PPE fits the employee i.e it is suitable for the employee. If this is not checked then you may just keep having this problem. Another question is that is this PPE maintained by the company or by the employee himself?
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Posted By Malcolm Hogarth
Chris,
Without wishing to appear flippant, are the safety glasses really necessary for the task? I am assuming risk assessments dictate yes,but wonder whether the hazard(s)can be removed at source, thereby solving the problem immediately.
Otherwise, the previous responses seem to have covered your options.
Malcolm
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Posted By Dave Daniel
It is true that HASAWA S9 precludes charging for things provided or done to meet your requirements.
I think there is little if any test case law on this point, but perhaps a you need to take another viewpoint:
You must always provide PPE for free, but if an employee fails to fulfil his duty to take reasonable care of his PPE this could be addressed via disciplinary procedures and as far as I can see there's nothing in H&S law to prevent you making a penalty deduction from an employee's wages on disciplinary grounds instead of sacking him. You are after all not "providing" anything. I'm not an employment expert so you'd need to clear this with your employment adviser and employment law, and write it into your employment contracts etc.
Of course this is all untested in court but all you face losing is the cost of the "fine". Few employees would take legal action over such a small amount.....
When in Rover Group in 1978, we introduced a national policy of providing prescription safety specs on the basis that "we pay for protection, you pay for correction" so costs were shared which encouraged care and use. The local HSE concurred this principle at the time.
Perhaps this is another way forward.
Dave Daniel
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Posted By Tabs
Where does he keep "loosing" them?
If it is at the workplace, introduce a lanyard to the glasses which is then pinned to his clothing.
If it is off site, introduce a system by where he has to hand them in at the end of his shift to his foreman/supervisor, and collect them again the following day.
After a week or so, ask him if he feels these procedures are still needed, allowing him to regain some control.
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Posted By brian mills
I had a problem with a person a few years ago, everyday I asked him where are his safety glasses? His reply was " he had lost them the answer was to supply him a new pair everyday, four days later he was wearing them everyday! His own intelligence made him realize that he would be soon making his position untenable.
Regards
Brian
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Posted By Crim
Does the employee have a locker where he can leave the PPE overnight or does he take it home? If he takes it home what does he do with it? If a locker at work then he must be instructed to leave the PPE in the locker.
This could be an easy answer, however if all else fails you could let the employee know that he cannot work without the PPE therefore he would be losing wages.
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Posted By Red Ones
I find it surprising so many people beat around the bush. Where he loses the PPE is irrelevant as a re a number of other points.
Assuming the need for safety glasses has been correctly identified following Risk Assessment preferrably with consultation of those carrying out the task, the the glasses are a requirement of the task. UNder the HASAWA the operative has a duty not only to others, but to himself, to safeguard against acident or injury. He is, therefore failing to comply with the HASAWA and is leaving himself open to prosecution and, if not managed correctly, the employer too.
I would have no qualms at all to sit down, explain his legal obligation and spell the facts out - if he continues to refuse to wear, or continue to lose the equipment the result is displinary and could lead to loss of employment. I would not resitate in looking at dismissal - purely I am allergic to prosecutions.
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