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Posted By Heathrow
Good morning all,
need some help with foxes, our site has suddenly become overrun with them. The women are treating them like pets and feeding them and now the things are coming into the warehouse. Any pointers please people ? When I suggest we need an exterminator I get colourful responses from most of the staff but i consider them a hazard after all they can carry wiels disease ! Any help is greatly appreciated.
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Posted By Heathrow
The problem is that staff are in close proximity to these creatures - they are hand feeding them ! All the infor i can find says this will never happen so theres no risk !
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Posted By Exdeeps
Mornin'
If people are hand feeding wild animals then you have a problem. (Would they hand feed rats by the way.) Wild animals will adapt to the environment they find themselves in but will not realise when they have ceased to be amusing and cuddly and step over the line and bite someone who won't feed them.
By way of an example google "save tusker". Tusker was a bull elephant who learnt that people at Charara campsite had nice food that he could steal, so he did. So far just a pesky elephant but still "cute". Last new year people stared to goad tusker from cars. Tusker didn't like that so he responded by stamping on cars as and when he found them. Now Tusker was a problem so the authorities shot him - Just because he stopped being funny and started to defend himself.sad but true.
By the way, I've walked through Charara at night and wondered "what's that noise" so shone my torch to find I was in the middle of a herd of grazing Hippo's - bit of a moment I can tell you but it is their home and I was a visitor,
Cheers,
Jim
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Posted By Alan Haynes
Dundee Council say
"...........although fox faeces are very smelly, they pose little disease risk. Foxes are prone to many of the same diseases and parasites as domestic dogs, including the roundworm Toxocara canis, the larvae of which can cause blindness in children. However, the chances of catching this from foxes are remote, and so far there are no known cases of children catching toxocariasis from foxes."
I suggest you try to stop the foxes being fed.
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Posted By Ron Hunter
The practices you describe will ultimately encourage other vermin in to your workplace, ones staff are less likely to hand-feed or tolerate.
This will hopefully sweeten the pill of clamping down on encouraging the foxes.
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Posted By graeme12345
I you could (but because you now know you cannot)I would leave them to carry on feeding them until they were bitten, it would be a good example for them of risk assessment.
Plus foxes are breeding at this time of year
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Posted By Geoff Parkinson
I'd suggest you cull the foxes AND stop the hand feeding.
As most culling takes place at night, there is no need for the staff to get alarmed - its one of those quiet activities that go on in the background when everyone else is asleep.
Feel free to contact me if you require contact details for people offering the service.
Removing the hand feeding will also reduce the risk of rat and/or mouse infestations.
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Posted By Rob T
How about you DON'T consider culling (nice way of saying kill them) them (and no I'm not a lefty, veggie, tree hugging, Guardian reading hunt saboteur as most regulars will know! Quite the opposite but I just don't like needless cruelty).
Why don't you phone the "Fox Project"or similar, who will humanely relocate the foxes to a better environment.
By the way - if some of those feeders are giving meat on cooked bones, then they are putting the foxes at risk as the bones become fragile and will shatter in their mouths causing severe injuries. Just thought that was worth pointing out!
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Posted By Heathrow
Does anyone have any links for fox culling ?
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Posted By Bob Thompson CMIOSH
email me directly i have some information.
Bob
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Posted By Lilian McCartney
I'm with Rob T on this, try to get them re-located first.
Stop all feeding, the more free food the more survive - there being more urban foxex than country foxes as its easier to live of chip shop throw aways and 'kind' people feeding them.
A problem I had at work before was the person who fed a local stray cat left and no-one elese wanted to and it got sick before I was told about it and then it had to be 'caught' by cat protection .
It did get well and re-homed right enough but it was suffering because there was no permanent committment.
Foxex and their young experience the same.
Lilian
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Posted By Geoff Parkinson
You can't (and shouldn't) relocate foxes from the town to the wild. It is irresponsible and they'll probably starve to death. Rummaging in a bin is not the same as hunting!
Heathrow,I'll drop you an e-mail re. 'options'.
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Posted By Rob T
How would you know Geoff? Your only response is to kill them! I know that, at least in Bromley (SE London) where I worked a while ago, they (the Council) regularly deal with organisations like the Fox Project (who do know what they're talking about) who relocate urban foxes, particularly from school grounds.
If killing animals when there are suitable alternatives available, is what rocks your boat well so be it, but don't encourage others to sink to that level.
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Posted By Geoff Parkinson
Rob,
if you really want to know, I kill (a word you seem to think we avoid) dozens of foxes a year as part of various control programmes. These may be on farm land, or urban areas. Many Councils use such services.
Culling - which actually has a definition, and isn't a mask to avoid using the 'K' word - is an effective way of managing the UK fox population. Often foxes that are trapped are subsequently destroyed. The idea is to solve the problem, not just move it.
'Heathrow' asked a question about fox control. He has a number of options, one of which is to have them culled. Offering to put him in contact with such a service does not make me a bad person. Stopping feeding won't fix the issue.
For every emotive subject, there are two very different camps. One side will say 'kill 'em all', the other wants to 'save them all'.
Living on a farm, I have first hand experience of foxes that have been 'relocated' into the wild. Their natural hunting skills don't exist, so they scavenge bins and kill lambs which are easy prey. I know you're thinking how does a farmer know the difference. Well, urban foxes are very different looking creatures. They often have bad fur, poor quality brush etc and are readily identifiable to the trained eye. Please review this media link http://archive.burnleyci...uk/2001/3/10/689077.html
I can't help but feel the 'fluffy bunny brigade' have hijacked a perfectly reasonable H&S professional's request for help and advice.
To prevent the thread degenerating, I am happy to continue this offline. My e mail address is above. Heathrow, I'll send you details dirctly by e-mail.
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Posted By Rob T
I don't think anyone has ever called me "fluffy bunny brigade" before so that's a first and made me laugh out loud. Normally I'm associated with the "flog 'em and cuff 'em" mob and been called various names such as Daily Mail reader (nah not ever - much prefer the Telegraph!) I'm also not a veggie and so there is no "meat is murder" type rubbish from me (does this now mean I've got to join the great unwashed?). No I'm more in the Anne Widdicombe camp where we don't like killing for the sake of it! Anyway, all I was saying was that the killing option should be an absolute last resort not a first!
All the best
Rob
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Posted By Martin J Morley
I don't see the need to kill any foxes.
A purely practical response to the matter of culling/killing is that if foxes have found the area to be inviting, their removal will only leave a void to be filled by new arrivals or growing offspring.
Only making the environment unrewarding stands a significant chance of success.
martin morley
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Posted By AlisonSM
Course there's the alternative option.."cull" those that feed the foxes!!
Only joking BTW!
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Posted By GeoffB4
Quote: Anyway, all I was saying was that the killing option should be an absolute last resort not a first!
You said a lot more than that Rob T, but I'm pleased Geoff Parkinson responded in a more mature way.
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Posted By Rob T
Well GeoffB4,
at least Geoff Parkinson had the intelligence to discuss the issue with reasoned arguments (as that is what this discussion Forum is about - you know - discussing) rather than just sit there sniping! If you have something to say then at least make it a contribution.
Remember - this is all about getting different points of view - not just your own one! That way people can get all the arguments and decide for themselves.
Rob
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Posted By Pete48
When all is said and done, foxes are wild animals. The human intervention of your staff is not helping these animals in any way.
Perhaps taking that approach and as has been said, make sure there are no temptations for them in your area of control would be the best natural way to solve this matter.
If you have never lived and worked with or amongst wild animals in their natural habitat, it can be difficult not to impact their lives by applying human values to their existence.
Just think about that almost uncontrollable urge to cuddle that snow tiger? It wont do either of you any good at all.
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Posted By GeoffB4
Rob T - hardly a snipe as I was responding directly to your reply below.
Rob T Quote:
"How would you know Geoff? Your only response is to kill them! I know that, at least in Bromley (SE London) where I worked a while ago, they (the Council) regularly deal with organisations like the Fox Project (who do know what they're talking about) who relocate urban foxes, particularly from school grounds.
If killing animals when there are suitable alternatives available, is what rocks your boat well so be it, but don't encourage others to sink to that level."
And congratulating Geoff on his reply when he could have responded in kind. Please read your response again (especially your second paragraph) and you'll see why I replied as I did.
I'm more than happy to discuss a number of subjects RoB T, try me.
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