Posted By Steve j B Any offers would be appreciated!

Posted By Robert Randall Hi Steve, there must surely be some part of the premises that are shared, e.g. the access and egress and the fire escape(s). Regardless of that any person who has, to any extent, control of the premises has a duty to conduct a FRA. If that FRA identifies that collective measures are necessary, e.g. a fire alarm, emergency lighting etc it would be a matter for the owner to install these and then discuss with the tenants the arrangements for covering the costs. Maybe an increase in rent would be the way to go!

Posted By Aileen Hi Steve You beat me yourself to my response. In my opinion, there should definitely be a generic Fire Risk Assessment - done by the Landlord - for the building. Each individual tennant will then need their own, written to suit their needs depending on what type of business they operate. Even though you say there are no communal areas, the very fact that it is a single building, albeit split into separate units, means that a fire in one unit will have an impact elsewhere. Fire alarms that sound in all the units at one time seems the most sensible approach. Aileen

Posted By Steve j B Thanks to those of you who have responded. Its much appreciated. Steve

Posted By Steve j B Thanks Crim, that's the line i have been taking so far which seems reasonable to me.

Posted By Steve j B With regard to my original question. Has anybody got any comments on how Section 4(2) HASWA ties in with the requirements of the RR(FS)O with regards to landlords duties. The way i read it is that the landlord has a duty to provide safe premises to his tenants. In my mind this would include such things as the mains electrical supply and circuit, gas safety, water quality (legionella), asbestos management etc and would include general fire safety precautions. Would you agree or disagree?? Steve

Posted By Robert Randall Hi Steve, this is usually a reference to "common areas and systems" such as the structure of the building itself, communal access and egress and any associated systems suich as lifts, emergency lighting, fire alarms, fire fighting equipment (in the common areas) and utilities such as electricity, gas, water, sewerage etc. The tenant in a commercial premises is usually responsible for these systems in his own part of the premises. The reasoning behind that is that the tenant may wish to add electrical circuits, gas appliances, water supplies, toilet facilities etc. to suit the requirements of his business. In the case of fire alarms it can be a bit complicated. Obviously if a fire in one unit would be likely to affect the other units then a case can be made for a common fire alarm system. This has its own problems however since an alarm has to be monitored and responded to by somebody. Whoever responds must, of necessity either by able to access all of the units or be able to call out key holders. There is also the, in my experience, very difficult subject of co-operation between tenants in the case of an evacuation procedure. I have had lots of experience of multi-occupancy premises with common fire alarm systems and not one of these were able to sucessfully co-operate on evacuation drills. If the premises is as you say, i.e. has no common areas then it may be simpler to allow each tenant to decide, on the basis of their own FRA whether or not to fit an alarm. I would still suggest however that you need to do your own FRA in order to ascertain which of these is the best option. Do you know for example what your tenants will be doing on the premises? Do they have any hot processes? Do they use flammable liquids? Do they have lots of combustible waste and if so how do they store and dispose of it? Regards, Bob R

Posted By Steve j B Thanks to all who responded to my question your comments are appreciated Steve

Posted By peter gannaway I agree that by the letter of the RRFSO, as the properties are under a full maintenance lease & no common areas responsible person then the tenants are in fact the controller of the premises. My only concern would be what would an insurer require. Presumably the landlord has the property insured, would the insurer be happy leaving the RA to tenants who may not have the resource or understanding to undertake a suitable & sufficient RA. I guess vetting potential tenants to determine their recognition of h&s safe systems should be part of the pre let process, but how many landlords would turn down a financial incentive over a h&s dis-incentive? Interestingly if it was found that an alrm should have been fitted, but wasn't when the lease ends, could it be a requirement of the lease to ensure that it would fit under the requirements to make good under delapidations. I have heard of landlords who have required remedial action on Asbestos to be undertaken, as tenants should have done so in order to comply with their legal obligations when they held the lease.

Posted By Robert Randall Just a quick correction to Shaun's contribution that "fire risk assessment is all about life safety". I would agree that the first priority in FRA is life safety but a comprehensive risk assessment would also consider property damage and business interuption. I cover all three in my FRA's. Businesses may however be reluctant to hire a consultant who covers these areas because the results in the hands of the Insurance Company may be an opportunity for them to avoid paying out on a claim!

Posted By Steve j B Thanks again to all that have responded your comments are much appreciated. I think the way forward in this particular case will be for the landlord to carry out a FRA for the whole building even though the tenants have full repair and maintenance arrangements and implement generic fire safety measures (detection and alarm and emergency lighting) throughout the premises for his own protection (property as well as life). He would then request the tenants to each carry out their own FRA for their particular units and implement specific measures commensurate with their undertakings such as fire fighting measures, evacuation procedures, signage etc etc. Think that should cover all angles Thanks again Steve