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#1 Posted : 04 June 2008 22:45:00(UTC)
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Posted By Martin Taylor
Oh the joys of fire extinguishers again.....

My fire extinguisher contractor is recommending a certain number of extinguishers to cover my site. The figures seem to be based on published advice for coverage but do not take into account that the site is fully sprinklered or that many areas are large warehouse spaces sparsely populated.

Question 1 what is the reference point for determining the recommended number of fire extinguisher in an establishment?

Question 2 - does this guidance take into account sprinklers and type of premises?

Question 3 - what is the status of guidance versus risk assessment based decisions

All answers and comments most most welcome

thanks

MArtin Taylor
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#2 Posted : 05 June 2008 14:25:00(UTC)
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Posted By Lloyd Cole
I believe Q1 is every 30 m.
If you have employees there , you must supply fire extinguishers regardless, plus all signage.
The Fire risk assessment must identify all fixed and portable fire fighting equipment, and maintenance procedures, plus the training regime in place for fire training- all if 5 or more employed......... you MUST also have a written emergency plan detailing above.. Hope this is of help
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#3 Posted : 05 June 2008 18:15:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ashley Wood
Most sprinkler systems are designed as property protection, some are designed as life safety systems. If the sprinklers are designed as a life safety system then you could reduce your level of extinguishers providing you can justify it within your fire risk assessment. I would say that your system is designed for property protection. As a rule 1 extinguisher every 200 m2 + additional as required i.e fork lift recharge area, electrical switch room etc etc.

If you are not happy with the extinguisher quote get another and compare.
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#4 Posted : 05 June 2008 22:28:00(UTC)
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Posted By Martin Taylor
thanks for the feedback guys.

I must admit I have a problem with the principle of fire extinguishers being a 'life safety' measure.

This may sound sacriligous for a safety professional and will probably get me drummed out of the club but........

When I do my fire risk assessment I make no assumptions about fire extinguisher usage in terms of helping to preserve life. I focus on ensuring that there are adequate means of escape for all and focus on that principle - I have to, I can't assume that even if I have 1 extinguisher for 200m2 and spaced every 30m and train every employee to be competent in the use of an extinguisher that the fire can be safely extinguished.

I can imagine 2 scenarios -
Scenario 1
slow burning fire - can be dealt with by a fire extinguisher but no threat to people evacuating the building. Should I ask a colleague to risk their lives to put out the fire which doesn't threaten lives?
Scenario 2
rapid burnig fire - threat to evacuating people - shoud I put colleague in very significant risk to try and extinguish the fire?

Are fire extinguishers there for life safety or property protection - preventing small fires becoming major fires?

Rant over - does anybody share my view? If you do how do you go about siting extinguishers and do you have any problems with legal compliance.

I do agree that extinguishers must be available in areas where escape may be compromised by fire and they are needed to fight an escape and in areas around flammables usage areas where small fires in the vicinity can be fought to prevent progress to the flammable area

cheers

Martin
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#5 Posted : 06 June 2008 13:12:00(UTC)
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Posted By Neil McLennan
Martin,

You know your premises better than anyone else including the fire extinguisher supply companies. Suggest you use common sense approach re installation of extinguishers. Agree that it could be dangerous for employees to fight any fire (unless minor) and certainly should not attempt without adequate training.
If fire extinguishers are needed other risk control measures have already failed and the main priority must always be to ensure that the fire does not occur in the first place.
Extinguishers at final exit doors are always a good idea.
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#6 Posted : 06 June 2008 16:18:00(UTC)
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Posted By Crim
Martin,

Your fire risk assessment will determine if and how many of what type of extinguisher you will need. There will be occasions when the sprinkler system is out of commission i.e. for maintenance, and then you will need to review the fire risk assessment and ensure provision of adequate fire extinguishers.

Do you have small areas without sprinkler protection i.e. storage cupboards, electrical switchgear rooms, under staircases etc.

Do you cover the heads when decorating? If so there is a need for alternative protection.

What about contractors carrying out hot work, do you provide hand held extinguisher then?

What does the insurance company have to say?

As someone else has stated extinguishers at exit doors are always a good idea,
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#7 Posted : 09 June 2008 21:03:00(UTC)
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Posted By Martin Taylor
thanks for the responses so far posters.

I am relieved that my views on assessment based locations are finding some support.

Where do I find the legal requirements though - indeed is it a legal requirement for fire extinguishers at all or can other facilities be sufficient and so go that extinguishers are not needed at all?

Martin
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