Posted By Jenny Perryman Hi, This is an everyday event for a lot of people so I would really appreciate some feedback. We have a large, busy warehouse, a yard, fork lift trucks and a limited amount of pedestrian movement (wearing of hi viz vests is mandatory.) The speed of FLTs is an obvious safety issue so we looked at having the electric ones, operating inside, governed to 5mph, but were told by the FLT company that it wasn't an option. Currently there are no speed limit signs either inside or out. There are two different points of view on the next course of action to be taken: 1). To be seen to be doing something to address and control the issue, put up 5mph max speed signs inside the warehouse and ensure drivers stick to a medium walking pace - bearing in mind competent, trained FLT drivers cover this in their training. 2). Do not put signs up as there is no way of monitoring the speed as being 5 or 6mph without a speed gun, no one has the time to dedicate to this, and it would theoretically be opening up a bigger can of worms. Backing this up, is the fact that the HSE came in a few months ago after someones' foot was run over by a FLT, and no mention was made about the lack of speed signage. I can see both sides of this, but would appreciate guidance on where it stands with regard to the 'letter of the law.' Thanks Jenny

Posted By Phil Errup Why don't you look at the level of supervision, and investigate whether or not they or whatever level of management you have in place, have it in them to actually pull someone over and speak to them about their driving. Do you discipline any drivers caught driving dangerously? How about a first warning then retraining or an assessment if they are caught again? Apply this in the yard and in the warehouse. Control the people not just the equipment and you are on the way to creating a much safer environment. Do you have any type of system to record that a driver has had to be spoken to? All of these things will be far more beneficial before you spend money governing the trucks. If the drivers aren't capable of driving safely, take the necessary action. If your supervisors are weak, train them. Or replace them if they cannot be trained. If the level of supervision is not great enough to supervise the activities, then address that issue too. Whatever you decide to do, good luck, Regards, Phil

Posted By Phil Errup Jenny, I've forked in many and managed a few warehouses, and none of them restricted the trucks. If the drivers are properly managed, there is no need to. When you ask where you stand legally, with regards to what? Do you mean if an accident happens because you restricted them? Regards, Phil

Posted By CFT Jenny BIG signs up, and I completely agree with Phil. CFT

Posted By Gill Shilton HSE made no mention of signage or restrictions. There is no ‘legal speed’ – business practicality, location common sense & training would determine in your large busy warehouse with limited pedestrian movement. Is this the first incident? Don’t knee jerk react to it if so! Step back - look at your accident investigation – what happened, how & why. Check against your risk assessment – identify the gaps & implement additional controls to improve. If speed was and is becoming an increasing issue then by all means restrict. BUT be prepared for the long term impact on the business! I agree with Darren. Speak to your FLT company - on modern electrics it’s an easy laptop adjustment to restrict speed to whatever you require.

Posted By Jenny Perryman Phil, All really sound advice, thanks. To be honest, 5mph was a speed that had been offered as one thought to be acceptable based on walking at 3mph, and then seeing signs in order books saying 5mph! I agree that first and foremost the people down the line need to be accountable, but I also believe that if anything happened it could be one less bone of contention, avoided by having speed limit signs visible. Once again thanks for your views. Regards Jenny

Posted By bluesail461 Hi Jenny, FLT speed restrictors built into trucks are not very practical as they are often used in yards or to cover longer distances and drivers would basically run them 'flat out' at 5mph all the time. Thing to do is look at the whole issue of traffic routes and segregation of pedestrians (I use your example of a foot being run over) - so identify your pedestrian/truck junctions, fit warning signs, barriers if its a permanent crossing point, zebra markings From a supervision point of view its fairly easy to judge if a truck is being driven with reasonable care - also use of flashing beacons for reversing (coupled with audible alarm) and sounding horn when going through doorways or round corners - having a max speed limit is probably a good idea (eg indoors 5mph, outdoors 10mph) but things like wet floors will therefore mean that its more about the way trucks are driven rather than just having a speed limit. I would have a limit and tell all the W/H staff why but its not the only thing to watch for. jez

Posted By Phil Errup I agree jay jay, that is why it is a maximum speed, not a recommended speed. So 7 mph on a long straight path in a yard is in some places totally acceptable, but again that is determined by the layout and gradient. And would advise the driver slows down when needing to turn. In all my years of working in warehouses with yards, speed has never been the cause of an accident, but the driver controlling that speed has. So if he/she needs to make a sudden sharp turn, I would be asking why. Either the layout is poor, or someone made a mistake. Personally any FLT operator having to make a sharp turn at speed, I would liken to a near miss and investigate before the outcome is a serious one. To further agree with your point, as it is a maximum speed, when laden, the driver should use his / her training and drive accordingly, which will mean slower. If not, then that is why I make my points regarding supervisory and management competency and ability. Redbull, I have wings again!

Posted By jervis If bits a busy warehouse have you completed a risk assessment for the flt. This want slow down the trucks but is there a pedestrian walkway marked in warehouse and flt one !

Posted By PL We use a rough translation of 5mph for inside both warehouse and factory as the trucks can't be limited (we have a very hilly site and require the trucks to cover all of it, so power limitation is not an option) and we have not got speedometers on our trucks. We then enforce, no faster than a fast walking speed. Easy for pedestrians and managers to check, monitor and supervise. This of course is backed up by signage and training (both for the drivers and those supervising activities). Where we identified special issues with regards to speed, we installed a couple of mobile speed indicators (like you see at the side of the road). These not only indicate speed but also alternate between a smiley and frowning face, dependant upon whether you're above or below the limit. A bit childish I know, but surprisingly effective.

Posted By Jenny Perryman Thank you to everyone for their input, a lot of really useful and helpful information. Regards Jenny

Posted By Glyn Atkinson Cure weak management by whatever means are deemed suitable - FLT's will often be needed to travel long distances across remote sites with no buildings, pedestrians etc. Why restrict them to 5 mph for this type of delivery journey as long as loads are secured / safe to transport and all workers / managers have the same hymn sheet to work from?

Posted By Brian Hagyard Jenny As you say your point B - By the time had had skim read all the response had forgotten the original question ! Thank goodness it was not an exam! Brian