Posted By Dan Platten
Dear All,

I wonder if you could pass comment on the following for us?

We currently provide CITB training for forklifts, but the CITB have sent a letter saying the following:

"CPCS test sites wishing to offer categories requiring a loading-out tower must have a temporary loading-out tower built out of scaffolding, either tube an dfitting or system (Quizk lock). THis will ensure that operators will have the necessary skills to load towers safely and correctly on site.
Simulations of loading out towers such as containers, H Section steel type towers, earth works or concrete strucutres will not meet the new Scheme requirements"

Our concern is that the minimum height of a loading out tower for our 17m machines is 12m high.

So rather than our purpose made, steel loading out tower, that is safe, the CITB are asking us to erect a 12m high temporary independant scaffold structure. As this is at a training centre, this is going to be permanent (if not you'll be employing scaffolders to put it up and down every other day!) and as its completely independent will require a purpose design and a big footprint no doubt.

This will also mean that this scaffold will then be subject to the regular checks in terms of 7 days, adverse weather etc. It also poses the question that as you are training, it is in danger of being hit etc, and could therefore collapse and then being reportable under riddor as its more than 5m height of scaffold.

Surely in light of the above, the CITB should consider the "Industry would expect CPCS Test centres to test their employees to a national standard scaross the country. The standard for a loading out tower in industry is scaffolding (temporary works equipment).

You thoughts would be very much appreciated.

Many thanks,

Dan

Posted By Dan Platten
Hi Graeme,

Of course not.

What we're trying to highlight though, is that just so that the scene of training resembles something on site, you are putting people at extra risk, causing a lot of extra unnessecary work, and potentially creating hundred of accidents up and down the country most of which could be reportable.

Yet a steel structure that is permantley fixed and anchored into the ground, can't be knocked down, doesnt require extra inspections, is safe in extreme weather, cant be climbed by children etc etc.

In addition, with an independant scaffold structure of that size, you are also going to have to have competent people to inspect the scaffold every 7 days etc which will require extra training or possibly an independant inspection as 12m is the minimum height for a 17m forklift!

Lets not forget that the purpose is to train drivers to load out loads onto a platform/loading bay safely. And lets not forget the key word "train" - accidents will happen through driver error, and a riddor reportable collapsed heap of scaffold is potentially what could happen.

I'm all for training people in the real environment to simulate and enhance learning, but sometimes, i think the risk should be evaluated first.

Posted By KCS
Hi Dan,

I think that you are trying to turn a COST issue into a SAFETY issue here.

On this occasion i belive that the CITB are completely right in what they are asking training providers to do.

Regards

KCS