Posted By Robert K Lewis Main one will be how come the windows could be opened wide enough to allow somebody to climb out? The method of opening limitation will come in for close examination. Ferom the owners viewpoint most locks can be defeated unless they are of good quality and well designed. Bob

Posted By Tabs Brenda - please give more detail. Are these vulnerable persons, is it a charity, is it LA, was a sensible set of systems followed before providing accommodation, are youngsters assessed, etc etc

Posted By John Donaldson Have a look at Falls from Windows in Health and Social Care http://www.hse.gov.uk/lau/lacs/79-6.htm

Posted By Della Pearlman You should also check the 2 items below: The Workplace (Health, Safety and Welfare) Regulations 1992 S.I. 3004 state that “ No window, skylight or ventilator shall be in a position when open which is likely to expose any person in the workplace to a risk to his health or safety.” and BS 8213-1: 2004 Windows, doors and rooflights – Part 1: Design for safety in use and during cleaning of windows, including door-height windows and roof windows, says that safety restrictors should be fitted to accessible opening lights where children or adults are at risk of falling out.

Posted By TT I've investigated a fatality not a million miles away from this accident. Drink was certainly involved along with a fair degree of unfortunate temporary lunancy. My opinion is that window restrictors are there to prevent accidents. Sounds straightforward I know, but where an individual purposefully bypasses controls then they choose to place themselves in increased danger. There are a million and one caveats to that comment though to include the health & social care setting etc. and I don't think I need to go into them (just saying it now so I don't get flamed on here!). I would have expected window restrictors to be in place (they were in my investigation but were being regularly broken by 'intelligent' students living in the rooms). Questions that arose included whether using breakable restrictors in the first place was such a good idea. Also, how often should those responsible for the premises be inspecting the restrictors, what should you do when you find them broken? The individuals described in this scenario (and here I go tarnishing all with a broad brush) don't sound like those who would take care not to break them if they thought they could get more air into the room to clear cigarette smoke, or even just for the fun of it. How good should the restrictors be? How good CAN they be against a determined individual? Minimum strength must prevent against breakage in the case of a fall against the window, but how much more? An interesting investigation albeit tragic for the individual involved. Conclusion was that the premises was not at fault but certainly could have been doing more in terms of checking up on the effectiveness of their controls and taking greater action against residents damaging property. Such thoughts might be of use during your investigation.

Posted By bill reilly to all who would be the enforcing authority for this type of accomodation ?

Posted By TT Re: Enforcing Authority It would depend on who owns and runs the property ultimately. Most privately run or charitable hotels, hostels etc. fall to the Local Authority to enforce but obviously if it is an LA owned and run premises then the HSE would be the enforcing authority instead. Private residential care homes fall to the LA whilst nursing homes fall to the HSE.

Posted By graeme12345 it was his fault not yours, and until enough people stand up and say enough is enough ( in a court of law) it will always be some one else's fault

Posted By Brenda H Hi Bill, Yes I was surprised too; however, I think what they meant was had there been window restrictors which were non able to be manually over ridden and the resident had broken them or deliberately forced them off, then they wouldn't consider this reportable. Anyway, it's been reported!

Posted By Brenda H Just re-raised this one.... There isn't any fire guidance or building reg guidance (please don't tell me to look at the bld regs as I find them all a bit daunting and confusing!) which states that HMO properties should be able to be fully opened is there? If there was a fire then the brigade aren't going to worry about a window restrictor are they? Surely they'll just pop the window? Anyone with fire background/experience able to comment? THanks

Posted By Fire Fly Climbing out of windows at heights in a drucken state can be hazardous for anyone. It is difficult to legislate or manage against individual or group stupidity and therefore corrective measures must be based on the lowest common denominator principle. The security and safety measure described all have merit but also consider preventive strategies such as enforced alcohol and illegal drug bans for residents as a start. By being in control of their senses and faculties it would reduce drastically the potential for harm or injury to themselves or others