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#1 Posted : 24 November 2008 12:51:00(UTC)
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Posted By srd
Our company has two manufacturing plants and a number of smaller admin offices with up to 20 people in each office.

Do we need to have an accident book in each office, or can we use accident reporting forms which are then returned to one of the two manufacturing plants and entered into their accident books?

Steve.
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#2 Posted : 24 November 2008 13:03:00(UTC)
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Posted By Dave Merchant
Why treat 'form' and 'book' as a different concept? Just return the completed loose-leaf forms to the office and file them.
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#3 Posted : 24 November 2008 13:13:00(UTC)
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Posted By Kirsty Davies2
Steve,

Workplace accidents must be recorded in the Accident Book (Form B1510), as required by the Social Security (Claims and Payments) Regulations 1979. These records must be kept for at least three years from the date of an entry.

In your scenario, I would recommend that your company should adopt systematic approach in order to record and investigate every accident appropriately and on time. There’s no need to keep the records in each office as you should keep all the necessary details in a place where a ‘responsible’ person can access them accordingly whenever required. Please note that there’s no harm in conveying the nature of accident to other employees at each office/site but you must not disclose the details of the personnel involved in the accident for confidentiality reasons (Data Protection Act).

Kirsty
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#4 Posted : 24 November 2008 13:15:00(UTC)
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Posted By Kirsty Davies2
In summary, fill in the forms whereever accidents occurs. Then you can file them at any other site.
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#5 Posted : 24 November 2008 13:27:00(UTC)
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Posted By srd
I should clarify that we do not keep accident books at each of the smaller office, just internal accident reporting forms which are then returned and entered into the accident books at either of the two manufacturing plants.

My concern is the HSE's references to accident books being required at each office, but I cannot find any information to say that internal accident reporting forms can be used.

Steve.

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#6 Posted : 24 November 2008 13:32:00(UTC)
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Posted By Kirsty Davies2
Steve,

You will be fulfilling the requirements by providing book or forms at each site but you can choose to store all the records/Main accident book at site where safety officer resides. (so that he/she can access the records in order to communicate with Law enforcing agencies, if need be)

Kirsty
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#7 Posted : 24 November 2008 13:52:00(UTC)
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Posted By Bob Youel
It is now perfectly legal and acceptable to have electronic recording and reporting systems provided such systems comply with the T&C's of the various laws etc and are useable by all that need to have use of them

Electronic systems can save lots of £ in many cases and I would do away with having difereing systems - one system should be able to fit all!

Just an another idea to evaluate
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#8 Posted : 24 November 2008 14:46:00(UTC)
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Posted By Zyggy Turek
Steve,

In February 2004 we sought permission from the Dept. of Works & Pensions to use our own accident recording system rather than using the Accident Book (BI510).

Here was the response:

"I can confirm that you may use an alternative to the Accident Book (BI 510) and I am happy to approve it without the need to see it so long as it contains the information below. To make sure your book complies with the Social Security (Claims and Payments) Regulation 1979 for the recording of accidents the following information should be captured-

Full name address and occupation of injured person
Date and Time of Accident
Place where accident has happened
Cause and nature of injury
Name address and occupation of person making the report if other than the injured person."



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#9 Posted : 25 November 2008 01:16:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Richards
The advantage of using a personalised accident recording system is that you get to put down what you want put down, and none of the inconvenient (and embarrassing) comments frequently inserted by the injured party.
f course, with no accident book for others (the oiks) to read you also do not have to worry about the dpa.....apart from the union safety reps.
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#10 Posted : 25 November 2008 09:20:00(UTC)
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Posted By Amandac
As posted earlier there is no requirement to use the 'accident book', however you must show that you are recording and retaining the information you are collecting on the 'forms' you choose to use. These forms need to record the information which is required by law and kept in accordance with the Data Protection Act and produced when asked to by the enforcing authority or for any claim against the company.
I have used Croners electronic system in the past and found it adequate for these needs and it also produces pretty graphs for meetings.
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#11 Posted : 25 November 2008 12:46:00(UTC)
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Posted By Alan Gunn - SHEF(S)
There is a free electronic incident/accident package at www.sheexpress.com it also has RIDDOR, investigations and claims.

There is an secure online subscription one that can be used by anyone, but it isn’t free.
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#12 Posted : 25 November 2008 23:45:00(UTC)
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Posted By Graham Bullough
I would echo Zyggy Turek's response and use your own organisation's accident/incident recording form. It will be legally acceptable for use provided that it contains at least the information which the DWP requires to be kept. As the official accident book form is notably sparse as regards what should be recorded, this will not be difficult.

My own employer's form includes space for considerably more information. This includes a box for comments by a manager or line supervisor regarding their findings and responses about whatever circumstances are being reported on it. Where appropriate this should include suggested measures to prevent further occurrences. Information in this box can help my colleagues and I in monitoring how well or otherwise line managers are managing health and safety in their areas of responsibility.
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#13 Posted : 26 November 2008 16:47:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ron Hunter
Kirsty, you're doing your 'Regulations' thing again. You really need to stop doing that.As others after you explain, there are other acceptable options available
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#14 Posted : 27 November 2008 09:43:00(UTC)
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Posted By Kirsty Davies2
Good Morning Everyone,

Just to clear a few things here – re: my earlier posts.

This thread was created in search of legal obligations regarding record keeping by the company. The words used are;

“Do we NEED TO HAVE an accident book in each office”

I am sure that Steve knows the importance of record keeping. His query was to clear his confusion on the legal requirements. Am I right Steve?

…..

I have responded to this query by mentioning the actual regulations which govern the requirements of record keeping. So that Steve can look into these (in person) for any further clarification.

Now, in my previous (second paragraph), I have stated that;

“company should adopt systematic approach in order to record and investigate every accident appropriately and on time”

&

“you should keep all the necessary details”

I think these statements would be suffice to confirm that, I totally agree with other post which suggests that other recording options are acceptable.

Ron – I personally believe that there’s no harm in mentioning ‘Regulations’ in the posts. (They can be useful for some people) – My apologies for people who are ‘allergic’ to the legislations.

P.S. Please forgive me for asking but for curiosity purpose, what is your age in safety field - Ron?
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#15 Posted : 27 November 2008 12:14:00(UTC)
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Posted By Ron Hunter
Kirsty, I'll e-mail off-Forum.
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#16 Posted : 27 November 2008 12:23:00(UTC)
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Posted By Abs Malik
You do not need a book, electronic forms or your own forms are acceptable so long as you ensure the forms contain the manadatory fields, eg name of IP, DoB, address etc.

I prefer own forms, you can make the forms very easy on the eyes and more appealing to staff rather than having your standard accident book!
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#17 Posted : 27 November 2008 12:37:00(UTC)
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Posted By Alan Hoskins
This is another topic which has been 'aired' many times previously.

At risk of hi-jacking this post, whatever happened to the proposal that we have a FAQ section on the website?

Alan
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#18 Posted : 27 November 2008 13:19:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Richards
Quite right.
It's boring now.
In any case, there is NO chance of the ICO prosecuting anyone for failing to keep data secure, they have no power/s to probe private companies.
There is little chance of the HSE doing anything, they have no staff.
There is totally no chance of the DWP doing anything either (if ever they do), no drive.
Accident reporting is going down, while accidents go up. Nothing new then ?
Less than 50% of RIDDORable accidents get RIDDORed, which means that the "accident"(al) book also gets a similar low amount of entries.
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#19 Posted : 27 November 2008 16:16:00(UTC)
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Posted By Kirsty Davies2
John,

Are you a safety officer?
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#20 Posted : 27 November 2008 16:24:00(UTC)
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Posted By Amandac
Just to add another dimension to this thread. Think of defending a claim from an IP. When a solicitor requests information in relation to a claim by an IP you will need to provide the information which is legally required. Although they always quote the accident book, company forms are more than acceptable as they do record more information.
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#21 Posted : 01 December 2008 13:44:00(UTC)
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Posted By srd

Thank you all for your replies.

I agree with the idea of an FAQ section.

I would like to point out that I didn't fire this post off without doing some research first, via the HSE web site and also Google.

I even searched on the term "accident book" on all forums and all years here on the IOSH site, but this only came up with 3 threads for the whole of 2007 and 2008 - none of which gave a definitive answer to my question.

I just wanted to make that clear in case anyone thought that I'd posted here as an easy option to doing some research first.

Again thank you all for your responses.

Steve.
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#22 Posted : 12 December 2008 16:15:00(UTC)
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Posted By Dr Hugh Brown
You could bypass the manual system and opt for a central software system allowing login from any site and control as defined by you... Google search "SHE Software" and "Optima Diagnostics"
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#23 Posted : 13 December 2008 10:34:00(UTC)
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Posted By John Richards
Any system is preferable to one that allows the injured party to write their own accident report !
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#24 Posted : 14 December 2008 14:30:00(UTC)
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Posted By Tiffany King
It should be accident form but does all the employees know how to fill up & use the form?
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#25 Posted : 13 January 2009 13:58:00(UTC)
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Posted By Toby South
HI SRD

As an idea why not try using a software solution to ease the process and ensure complaince.

I have had good dealings with Enable Infomatrix (www.myeix.com / 01789 208060) they offer a very cost effective option.

Give them a call

Good luck

Toby
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