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Posted By Garry Adams
To all and Sundry
Recently the Oil and Gas Operators finally done the right thing and admitted the existence of a NRB ( Not Required Back ) Culture within Industry. However, the Oil and Gas Operators are now working with the Work Force to rectify this illegal practice.
Question to the Forum:
Given the most recent revelation that a Black List has been unearthed which contains the names of Construction Workers who have voiced concerns regarding H&S Issues within the Workplace...what corrective and or remedial action can the H&S Community do to eradicate this illegal practice. Furthermore, will the named Workers have a case in Law to prosecute the Building Contractors for lose of wages and damages.
The connotations are and the list of implications maybe extensive.
Your thought please.
Garry...
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Posted By A Campbell
I did see a lot of this culture in the oil & gas industry unfortunately and was mainly within the realms of contract workers or agency...
I have even known H&S professionals that were not immune from the culture.
It's a positive sign but most likely a negative viewpoint is that it could also be called something else... a change of abbreviation etc but a similar ethos.
The fast pace of workforce labour market has always been susceptible to abuse and in many cases distrust
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Posted By Pete Longworth
This sort of thing has being going on for a long time. In my youth I was a very active trade unionist working in engineering. As I got older I became less active. In the late 80s I was contacted by a journalist for a national newspaper who was collaborating on a documentary for World in Action about an organisation called The Economic League. Apparently he had managed to get copies of some of their files one of which was about me. Others were about a number of friends. He sent me the copies and asked if I would take part in the program. I agreed but in the end the program was made about a poor guy from Liverpool who had committed suicide because he couldn't get work due to the Economic League Blacklist.
The files contained a list of my activities, things like led strike in August 1983, wrote articles for Militant etc. The scary ones were ones like - positively identified at rally addressed by Arthur Scargill etc.
Following screening of the documentary questions were asked in Parliament and the Economic League was supposed to have been closed down, but I suspect it still operates in some form or another.
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Posted By Bob Youel
This subject is in the press today re construction companies working in Manchester in 2009!
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Posted By peter gotch
Hi Garry
When I worked in Construction Group, from HSE's Glasgow office from 1986-1990, there was widespread knowledge of a blacklist of construction workers particularly in London.
The activities of the "Economic League" discussed in Parliament as long back as 1989 if not earlier.
Regards, Peter
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Posted By Garry Adams
A Campbell
I was party too the occupation of Offshore Platforms in the 80's and for my part in the Dispute to improve Offshore H&S Conditions I was given the passed over for 3 three years before I set foot aboard another Offshore Installation. I have no problem with an Organisation and or an OIM issuing a NRB Order on an individual whom represents a security risk or is considered a threat to National Security,therefore, a Government Operated Data Base should be collated by MI5 for that purpose ( it would be nieve of me to surmise that a Government Data Base listing radicals is not already in existence ). However, it is quite a different thing for a privately run Organisation to hawk secret information for profit...who is to say that the information is accurate or indeed legal...the Organisation in question will be prosecuted under the Data Information Act and on a successful prosecution, Civil actions can be raised.
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Posted By Garry Adams
Peter
This unsubstansiated allegations which have blackened the names of the listed Operatives is an affront to the Civilised Free Democratic Word. The hardship that many have suffered through out the decades as a direct result of this practice in unforgivable. It has driven many to the bread line and beyond, to the point of distraction and deprivation.
Garry...
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Posted By Garry Adams
Peter Gotch
I agree that this unsavory practice has been in Operation since time in memorial, however, in the Civilised World surly the Government must lead by example and Govern...these Construction Companies who subscribe to the Data Base is aiding and abetting in an offence by supporting an illegal Organisation...I do not want to appear paranoid, however, it would not surprise me to learn that the Data Base is funded by the Construction Companies.
Garry...
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Posted By Garry Adams
Bob
As you are no doubt aware the Construction Industry is not alone, it is widely acknowledged that Black lists exist in all Industries.
Victimisation comes in a cloaked form, those who voice H&S and T&C Concerns are removed from the Workplace one way or the other. It is up to the H&S Community to support the sacrificial lambs and speak out and let right be done.
Garry...
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Posted By Raymond Rapp
Call me naive but I am shocked that these practices still prevail today. I am aware of allegations in the past, but thought that was in the 'bad old days' of the 70s and 80s where the unions were more volatile. No one should be blacklisted for raising health and safety concerns.
As an ex TU rep I would be quite offended if I was not included on any blacklist.
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Posted By Garry Adams
Raymond
I too have a lingering suspicion that my name maybe included in some Data Base stashed away in a dusty vault, however, I can take Solis in the fact that my name will be listed Men of Morals.
Garry...
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Posted By John Richards
With reference to the not-so-much reported construction blacklist: No prosecution will take place.
It will just disappear.
The ICO is toothless, gutless and pointless.
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Posted By phalda
The thing here is proof methinks... I voiced concerns everyday on a particular job recently.. ( just done cons.cert so just a decor supervisor).. The site management tried everything under the sun to get me off the job.. eg work quality not good enough ( though clerk of works v, happy).. I even approached the Safety advisor with the question... Why have you never asked any worker on this site if they are happy with the H/S.. to which he replied... If they have concerns they should see the site manager... YES OF course they will.. then the company they work for will be awarded no more work from the PC.. this is the way it is...
I left the job 1 week ago as I could not handle the unsafe conditions and did not want to cost my boss the work...
So Lets get real here .. there will always be blacklists even if only by word of mouth..
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Posted By Garry Adams
John
An enforcement Notice has already been served upon the M.D. Of the Organisation.
A Criminal prosecution is under consideration and Civil action forthcoming from the Trade Unions.
The Government have had an Act on the Statute books for quite some time, however, the unearthing of the List will allow them to enact.
Watch this space...The Work Force is at saturation point...enough is enough.
Garry...
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Posted By Garry Adams
phalda
What you have just described amounts to constructive dismissal, bully boy tactics enforced by the PC's cudgel men.
Yes, your bang on the money, its time to GET REAL...its time that the Workforce got up from their knees and stand up for what is right.
Garry...
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Posted By phalda
Garry..
I could not agree more...
The main reason I have just done the Construction Cert with Fire Cert coming up is basically so I know what I am talking about and also to have some credibility when I bring these matters to the attention of the Management of the various PC s we encounter..
Hopefully my concerns will be dealt with effectively without need to take things to the HSE etc....
One can only try.
P
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Posted By Garry Adams
phalda
The pen is mightier than the sword and knowledge is power over ignorance.
One must match or better one's advisories on points of H&S Legislation during open debate, study long and hard and your arguments will prevail.
Garry...
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Posted By John Richards Garry. Yes, I did know about the enforcement notice. That news was on the ICO website on 6-03-09: http://www.ico.gov.uk/up...9/tca_release_060309.pdfAs was the list of companies that paid for the information: http://www.ico.gov.uk/Ho...sulting_association.aspxI remain unconvinced that anything [meaningful] will happen, other than the company facing relatively minor charges. Civil action/s may be started, but I have no doubt that the company will disappear and said prosecutions will be unsuccessful in obtaining any worthwhile remuneration for those offended against. Time will tell. Still, at least the corporate operations will have had a quick tensing of the relevant sphincter.
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Posted By Garry Adams
John
Thanks for the Links...and ye lol, no doubt there will be more that the clenching of fists in certain Boardrooms...I would not like to be within striking distance once the proverbial hitting the fan...
Garry...
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Posted By John Richards
Thinking further.
The companies involved are not exactly small companies.
Does their involvement indicate ignorance of the law/s, or contempt for same ?
My previous experience of data "protection" would indicate (to me) that contempt is the answer, but whether of the law or a persons right to confidentiality is another question.
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Posted By Garry Adams
John
The plot thickens...
Given that the Construction Companies involved are Operated by both Executive and Non-Executive Directors whom have a Management Team which would include Legal representation I would submit that ignorance of the Law is no defence, furthermore infringement of ones human rights can be raised at the European Court of Human Rights.
Moreover, many of the Directors are in a position of privilege, i.e. access to the Parliament and the other place...perhaps there is a question of abuse of position.
The bottom line is these Organisations have been exposed...the Oil ans Gas Industry put their hands up to a Black List and a covert Not Required Back Culture 2 weeks ago...was this good timing or did they have insider on the imminent exposure the Construction Black List ???.
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Posted By A Campbell
If memory corrects me..
The main reason that the old NRB system started was due to industrial unrest in the offshore sector.
It then started into a common place system - spreading to non production facilities as unless contracted to carry out a certain task it was the norm to be placed into a vacant position via the agency route for a minimum of 3 months.
If you did not come up to their expectations then the agency was requested not to send you back there..... in addition for seasonal well experienced personnel it was also a matter as to how your working relationships & personality was also a factor taken into account.
This had nothing whatsoever with regards to security related concerns offshore, in fact security is pretty tight and has been for a number of years out there.
With my feet firmly on the ground these days, I cannot comment on the systems currently in place.
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Posted By Garry Adams
The NRB Culture was in force prior to the OILC Occupation of North Sea Installation, the established NRB Culture merely served a tool to embargo selected activists form returning to the Workplace , Firstly as a punishment for heir descent and Secondly as a warning to those who were granted a reprieve.
The NRB Culture still exists, however, the Oiland Gas Industry is working with the Stepchange to Safety Organisation and Union Officials and Members in an attempt to eradicate the NRB Culture.
The NRB Culture was wide spread, not only Agencies, Operators and Contractors alike used the threat and application of NRB.
The NRB is used at the OIM's Discretion, i.e. when the Security of the Personnel and the Installation is compromised by a deranged individual or delegation, threatening to cause Industrial Espionage, i.e. Blow up the Installation.
I agree security both on Offshore Installations and allied Onshore Facilities are as tight as a camels in a sand storm,on a recent assignment, I was subject to an MOD cheque prior to admittance to St Fergus Gas Terminal. Suffice to say I posed no threat and was allowed to enter.
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Posted By Raymond Rapp
Having just read the ICO statement and seen the list of companies involved, which reads as a who's who of construction, it confirms my belief that 'corporate governance' is a load of old tosh.
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Posted By A Campbell
I always had the notion that many PC's liked to play god.... this appears to take it even further!
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Posted By Garry Adams
To reiterate my original Question to the Forum, "what corrective and or remedial action can the H&S Community do to eradicate this illegal practice" ???.Or has the repercussions of the NRB fear culture spread to the very people who profess to be the defenders of H&S Philosophy, so hard fought for.
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Posted By A Campbell
Gary,
Firstly I do not for one moment think that H&S related professionals have been/are immune to the culture by their nature of bringing up such a topic in open discussion with senior management. NRB was/is a taboo subject and if indirectly driven or aware of such practices would be a potential slippery slope.
Secondly I would ask what this has to do with H&S?... Unless of course the reason for the action is due to a complaint and/or result of human error which has an indirect blame culture and finger pointing going on?
For such information to be able to be passed on to HR or head office areas, it must arise from the actual site and via senior site management.
So who/where is the driving force located for such an environment?
If you have the means to eradicate such practice I would expect it would be borne from a moral perspective rather than a professional one (IMHO)
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Posted By Garry Adams
A Campbell
The list contains names of Operatives whom have raised concerns regarding H&S issues within the Workplace and for their pains have been branded trouble makers and militants.
These Operatives should be praised for exposing Non-Compliant Practices and Breaches of H&S Legislation...not vilified for it. They are the Men of Morals.
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Posted By A Campbell
I'm sure Gary,
If you are indeed employed by a major construction company or equivalent and are able to make a professional input and challenge their use of such systems I would certainly like to know how you get on and the end result?
I certainly sympathise with anyone who receives such retribution when they are only trying to ensure everyone works in a safe environment.
And as already written.... I knew it was happening, did not enjoy it and as I had no senior management clout.... got out of it.
There are some areas that are well and truly out of one's control and at the time this was one of them... although was well documented in the press at the time e.g. Brent Spar, Shell, BP, Occidental etc etc
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Posted By Garry Adams
A Campbell
One can only seek representation via the individuals M.P. and their Lordships and lobby H&S peer group member to register their concerns.
After 37 years in the Oil and Gas Industry and numerous toe to toe engagements with the Hierarchy of Decision Maker within the Industry, I acknowledge many positive changes...however, there is always room for improvement.
Perhaps the best policy is, to get your shift in the best way you can.
Best regards
Garry...
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Posted By Neil R
I must say that i am glad the existence of these databases are now public knowledge, I work for a major construction company that doesn't and has never subscribed to this underhanded practice, the company i work for has been lobbying for years to have this practice exposed to no avail.
The actual idea is sickening, how can you hold something that happened 15-20 years ago against someone? ridiculous.
It has major safety implications to, if you worked for a company that is now known to use the list, would you highlight a safety implication, or report a dangerous action or work area? no chance, and be branded a troublemaker.
Sadly it's been going on for too long and now its common knowledge the government needs to come down hard on these companies and make an example of them.
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Posted By Karen Todd
Sorry for the late response.
A variation on a theme perhaps, but what about the "standing down" of temps?
Came across this in my first ever job (engineering company, 500+ workers). Heard a comment, "Oh, we just stand them down" (about agency workers). I asked what it meant, they said, "We just ring the agency up and they tell the worker they aren't required back any more. They take care of it all". And when you need more workers? "Oh, we just ring the agency and they send some more, if they aren't up to scratch we stand them down"...
KT
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