Posted By Gary Malone I have in my opinion an over zealous CDM-C making our life pretty miserable on a minor project. I work for a demolition contractor who is in the process of demolishing two small single storey one two storey industrial units. There are a maximum of 4 operatives onsite at any point. There is a combined canteen/ office cabin with warm running water etc. However we have in place a porta-loo. It was my understanding that whilst these units are not prefered these are sufficient within the cdm regs and the legislation in force. How-ever he advises that these are illegal and has requested me to prove that these are legally compliant, I am unable to find any such legislation I would appreciate any help to identify specific legislation on the use of these or the prohibition of use of these. Over and above this the requests by the CDM-C are shocking. I am a qualified CDM-C and have undertaken many projects, the CDM-C's are from a large consultancy and proudly promote their AIIRSM badge and Tech Iosh post noms. I have literally spent hours upon hours explaining and justifing what we are doing risk assessments, method statements, inductions, my email address etc etc Thanks

Posted By CFT Now't wrong with what you have in place Gary (IMPO), and certainly nothing illegal. Suitable and sufficient springs to mind. Ignore your impending 'hissy-fit' and have a good weekend. CFT

Posted By Richard Altoft If and at every occasion what they want is in excess of what the law requires then demand an instruction so that you can invoice either them or the client for the extra costs. If they dispute it ask them to put their case in writing so that you can go to arbitration. Loser to pay all costs. R p.s. if you need a god arbitrator let me know.

Posted By Gary Malone Martin, CFT, Crim, and Richard thank you very much for your help! All have a good weekend!!! However I do think that I have put their nose out of joint in my previous reply telling them, that I was fully aware of the cdm regs and pointed out the main changes were to reduce bureaucracy and to ensure minimum competencies for examples CDM-C's, amongst other things.

Posted By Gary Malone Bob, Thanks for your reply, yes we are on-site and I have already challenged the CDM-C as to what role they are actually visiting our site, however we have been advised that the Client has requested this by the CDM-C. The Client is a Government Body. Bunkabins are an excellent option onsite, I have used these myself on many occasions. Thanks Again!!

Posted By Sharastani No need to take a hardline with the CDMC with this issue. 4 men on site, go to the loo twice a day, do a wee wee or No 2, wash their hands with a sanitizer, suitable toilet roll- not sandpaper, and the effluent is disposed of. Where are the hazards that would not be associated with regular toilets? Let them answer that.

Posted By Phil Rose Gary - sorry to hear of your problems. Clearly there is nothing at all wrong with using porta loos as long as there is a sufficient number (which there appears to be) and they are maintained as necessary. I am not sure where the CDMC is coming from, there are 100's of porta loo companies out there providing umpteen 1000's of porta loos for both work situations and events etc. They are a common feature on many many sites and perfectly acceptable, indeed in the 'old' days many smaller sites would have had nothing at all! If that is all that he/she has to worry about then it does make me wonder about the competence of the CDMC

Posted By FAH Gary, if you're so confident of your position; contact the BERR directly & request a meeting to discuss the flagrant lack of competence of your Clients CDM-C appointees which is directly contrary to the whole ethos of CDM & what the BERR is charged to accomplish. You could also go directly to the Client; even though a Govt body as they will ultimately be the ones with the power to fix your problems. Of course, if none of that appeals [or works]; you could always look for a newspaper wiling to embarass anyone or everyone involved. Alternatively, it's possible that IOSH may wish to publicly take it up as it appears such a gross example of incompetence, ineptitude, & waste as well as bringing H&S into greater disrepute. Frank Hallett

Posted By FAH Hi Gary Glad to be of assistance, I do try to be constructive [it's Sunday evening, cut me some slack!] BERR are the body that you've found whose principal reason for existance is to be the UK Governments' weapon of choice in removing or reducing unnecessary burdens on business. Go back to the website you've found & see what their remit is. If you have a Govt Dept that is actively or implicitly supporting or condoning the opposite it will make last weeks politics look very tame - provided you can get a back-stage view. Go for it! All you really have to lose are the equivalent of a very big albatross creating unguessable hidden expense for your outfit and the Govt. That will really go down well. Frank Hallett

Posted By Arran Linton - Smith Gary, You are correct to state that the plastic self-contained toilet units that you find on some sites are not illegal and providing there are adequate washing facilities provided, then these are not a problem, however if you are relying on the tiny hand washing facilities within these units, then arguably these do not meet the criteria within the current HSE Guidance CIS 18 which is why the Oasis Unit were developed. Have a look at http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/cis18.pdf

Posted By Gary Malone Ron, Arran, Peter, Thanks very much for your opinions, yes I do agree with you, and I would prefer that there a better standard of toilet faclities on-site, and would certainly have no issue with clients putting minimum standards. However in this case there are no minimum standards communicated within the pre-construction information, or at the pre-start meeting (with regard to welfare facilities)other than the principal contractor is to adhere to cdm regs 2007 section 22, If this was the case we would of adhered to these standards. Down to communication. Yes there are adequate washing facilities within the cabin. Regards Gary