Hello all,

A poser about construction work on farmhouses. I'm clear about the position on buildings other than the farmhouse, but a little stuck about work on the farmhouse. HSE make it clear that CDM client duties do not apply to work carried out on the farmhouse, as it is the farmer's domestic dwelling. I'm not sure I entirely agree with this as a) the farm business is run from the farmhouse and b) the costs of any such construction work would no doubt be paid out of the farm accounts.

I can't get my head around the "domestic client" bit. I don't think a farmer is as he's at work, but given the above it's a bit blurry.

If I am a farmer having construction work done on my farmhouse, what legal duties do / do not apply to me? Do we assume I am an employer engaging contractors and therefore all the relevant safety legislation applies (HSWA S3, Management Regs, etc); or, do we assume that I am purely a domestic client and that I only owe a common law duty of care (Occupiers Liability etc), etc.

Regards,
KT

Further, CDM does apply to the domestic client as far as contractor's health and safety is concerned, it is only the notifiable bit that doesn't.

KT, I think you raise an interesting point i.e. is the farmer in respect of his ‘farmhouse‘ really a domestic client? The SI interprets what a client is but not specifically what a domestic client is and the ACoP doesn’t help all that much. I take Chris’s point about his own situation, but there are farmhouses and farmhouses. In some farmhouses, the domestic use of the property is often pretty secondary to the use of the property for the running of the business.

The other thing is that you haven’t clarified or been asked to clarify is whether the farmer is a tenant farmer or an owner occupier. If the former and the work is being done by the landlord then I think that changes the situation and I would argue that the domestic client scenario no longer applies and that subsequently the client duties would apply.

Re #3 “Further, CDM does apply to the domestic client as far as contractor's health and safety is concerned, it is only the notifiable bit that doesn't” - could I suggest a quick look at the last sentence of para 28 of the ACoP http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/priced/l144.pdf

Thanks Phil - Para 29 added to my confusion. I get what they are saying with the shop example, and in that instance the "shop" bit and the "residential bit" although within the one building are usually clearly separated (but again in practice I bet the entire property is listed as an asset on the balance sheet and that the works would be paid for by the business account, but I suppose tax legislation and safety legislation are 2 entirely different matters!).

KT

I am not quit so sure if the 'split' is quite that simple. As I have tried to point out in one part of my post, if there is a landlord/tenant relationship (which has yet to be established), even work on bedrooms and kitchens would come under the regs