My problem: we have a call centre location which runs 24/7. Daytime provision of first aid is fine, however the complication arises 'out of hours'. We have 14 employees who work night and weekend shifts (3 at night and 2 atweekends); these employees are not static and do rotate. I am trying to find a cost effective solution to first aid provision. The landlord does provide security personnel but these can not be relied upon to be appropriately trained first aiders - we need to find our own solution. The distance from the nearest hospital is reasonable, there is no history of accidents or incidents with these teams and there is no lone working.

Hi Sharon

I agree with Blodwyn, and have the same arrangement where we have a 24 hr site and the security teams are trained ranging from the simple 1 day emergency to the full first aider.

It may cost you a few £'s per month as a payment suppliment but you know you are covered and compliant.

Good luck

I fear I am going to fly in the face of 'convention' here. You haven't mentioned what your risk assessment has determined the risk to be, but looking at the few facts that I have I assume that the risk is pretty low. Therefore according to the First Aid ACoP L74 http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/l74.pdf (not the new guidance on training requirements) and have a look at appendix 1 on page 24 and then look at the flow chart on page 27, you might well find that you can comply by using an appointed person only. In brief, the flow chart says, low risk environment (offices), with less than 25 employees (at any one time) = at least one appointed person. Note that this flow chart has been updated to take account of the revised guidance on training and includes EFAW as well.

If you look at the FAQs for the new guidance http://www.hse.gov.uk/fi...d/review/trainingfaq.htm and the flow chart mention above, you will see that the Appointed Persons roles still remains and remains 'valid' for low risk environments. You should also know that it doesn't take a day to train someone to Appointed person standard. Most providers take a day to do it because they include within that first aid training, but this is not a requirement to become an AP. The AP duties are limited to looking after the first aid kit(s) and calling the emergency services when required. See L74 paras 7 and 67-70. I do not belive that AP's HAVE to go on an HSE approved course to become an AP.

I tend to feel that it is good practice to have someone with first aid skills there and therefore I wonder if the EFAW course would be preferable, BUT I suggest that you would be 'covered' and 'compliant', if that is all you are seeking by nominating APs. Allternatively you could nominate APs and give them some basic first aid training commensurate with the likely hazards to be found in the environment.

Of the 3 at night and 2 at weekends how many are the same people? If the 2 weekenders are the 3 nighters on rotation then send them all on an EFAW course. Esp. as security can be in the wrong place at the wrong time and EFAW training will be a lot less cost wise than a full on F.Aider.

Badger

Indeed, what level of cover is required? Is there a need for first aiders or would apopointed persons suffice, bearing in mind what I assume is a pretty low risk environment and activity? The ACoP provides guidance on this.

Hi Sharon

I don't see that you need to provide any trained first aiders over the weekend / nightshift. Given the level of risk and the numbers involved I would tend to make sure that everyone has been instructed on the role of an appointed person and advise them to call the emergency services in the event of a real emergency.

The 'dayshift' trained first aiders will no doubt look after first aid kits etc.

Carry out a first aid assessment and then you can justify your decision to only have appointed persons.

FH

I agree Phil that the need to formally 'appoint' someone to call the emergency services shouldn't be necessary but I think I'm correct in stating that there should be an appointed person 'as a minimum' in each workplace?

In the type of situation Sharon describes then there is no problem having a mix of trained first aiders and APs - and in these situations the APs role would not even involve looking after first aid kit etc.

As I say simply provide all employees with basic instruction of what to do in an emergency and ask that one of them takes charge in the event of any situation arising - so I suppose whoever calls emergency assumes the role of an AP by default.

We do, of course, have trained first aiders where our assessments deem them to be required.

FH

Apologies Fornhelper, perhaps I need an eye test to drive this DSE.