Welcome Guest! The IOSH forums are a free resource to both members and non-members. Login or register to use them

Postings made by forum users are personal opinions. IOSH is not responsible for the content or accuracy of any of the information contained in forum postings. Please carefully consider any advice you receive.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Anne Smart  
#1 Posted : 15 March 2010 10:26:44(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Guest

Morning everyone,

The Independent has published an opinion piece from IOSH chief exec Rob Strange today, in which he questions the way the media portays health and safety.

You can read the full article by following this link to the Independent online: http://bit.ly/bHFuak

What do you think of the piece? Do you agree with Rob's comments? The media team would appreciate your feedback on this.

Many thanks,

Anne Smart, IOSH media and campaigns co-ordinator
Canopener  
#2 Posted : 15 March 2010 10:49:10(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Canopener

I think Rob pretty much sums up how the majority of us feel about H&S is often portrayed in the media; in particular the tabloid press. His commenst are long overdue. I recall on the 'old' forum the seemingly endless and tiresome posting of links to DM H&S 'stories' and the subsequent debate that often followed, with people 'lambasting' individuals on the basis of what can at best be described as 'dubious' reporting. It seems to me that many of these health and safety stories are just that; stories.
Cruisin' Susan  
#3 Posted : 15 March 2010 10:52:59(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Cruisin' Susan

This is an excellent initiative, long overdue. An informative piece of writing and I look forward to seeing the media interest & reponses it generates. Well done.
Clairel  
#4 Posted : 15 March 2010 11:54:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Clairel

hmmmm, this might not go down well but...

Of course the way that media present elf n safety news stories is wrong. No disputing that.

However, we can't use that excuse not to turn our gaze inwardly as well. There are many health and safety professionals (including some that post on this forum IMO) that are over zealous in their approach to health and safety and those people are feeding the elf n safety stories in the press.

So whilst I agree that the media needs to show a more accurate reporting syle (dream on!!) I think we also need tackle the problems within our own community too.

By the way, the comments beneath the article do have a point. With the decrease in heavy industry in this country there would have been a reduction in fatal accidents anyway so it is hard to attribute how much is down to an improvment in health and safety - although I like to think it has made a significant difference. There has in fact been an increase in occupational health disorders in line with our changing work environment. you could argue that RSI is better than a fatality but I'd rather not look at it so simplisitically. I shudder to think what would happen to the figures if you included those who die whilst driving on work business. Have the fatalities dropped or shifted to another area?

IOSH (and other H&S bodies - pull together not apart) should do more to dispel the untruths in the press but we should also do more to stop the sparks that light the fires.
Yossarian  
#5 Posted : 15 March 2010 11:55:31(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Yossarian

Well done IOSH and Rob.

The posters in the comments section seem to be struggling with with the concept of an "opinion piece" though.

A Lawyer touting for work (which I think was the case in the year old article misquoted from SHP) is always likely to have a different opinion to a Safety Practitioner trying to minimise injury rates.

Also, I think someone may have to reply on the claim that the stats do not take into account decreased UK Manufacturing.

A pointer to the following link might help as it has stats that show a downward trend in Manufacturing in Fatality, Major Injury & RIDDOR rates per 100000 employees:

http://www.hse.gov.uk/st...nufacturing/injuries.htm

In addition the following document is useful:

http://www.hse.gov.uk/st...ics/overall/hssh0809.pdf

Where on page 8, the graph shows fatality rates per 100000 employees are at an all time low of 0.6

However, I would not be surprised if the facts are glossed over by the posters outrage.
freelance safety  
#6 Posted : 15 March 2010 12:25:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
freelance safety

Well done Rob and IOSH. Totally agree with the points made.
Maybe next we could have some TV coverage to get to the masses?

On the negative side, I have some agreement with Clairel. In our profession we have a small number of people who mean well but, possibly due to experience and technical ability, go either on a crusade over quite trivial matters or give poor advice.

Also, over the years I’ve personally come across individuals proclaiming to be health and safety experts who give some of the most appalling and dangerous advice you could imagine. These experts have turned out to have little in the way of qualifications or technical ability. Many claim to be Chartered and are not, quite a few even utilise the IOSH logo.

But the majority of companies and other bodies that I’ve had dealings with are not aware of this. They see a title of health and safety and wrongly assume that they are engaging with a competent individual.

I applaud the work by Rob and all the hard working individuals of IOSH but I also believe that until we are more prescriptive in terms of competency, whether by legislation or not, we will always get this very negative press.
Bob Howden  
#7 Posted : 15 March 2010 14:09:56(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Bob Howden


Good piece.

Another problem that the press seem to have is their seemingly hypocritical position where they promote the idea that people should have the freedom to make their own choices as long as they can blame someone else when it all goes wrong.
KieranD  
#8 Posted : 15 March 2010 16:04:25(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Guest

One cheer for a clearly written article on an important subject, especially to readers of this forum.

Sadly, however, it was a good opportunity that was not converted into a thoughtful response to the proposed Conservative Party strategy on a non-trivial change to the system of regulating safety and health at work.

The article by Mr. Strange would have had much greater credibility if he had taken up the Tory challenge, and set out the issues clearly and factually. He could, for example, have cited relevant data about the OHSA Voluntary Protection Program in the USA and, in particular, of the extent to which the 'Star' and 'Merit' categories in this scheme have measurable benefits as well as possible limititations.

To the extent that the occupational safety and health profession is going to be taken seriously, it will have to engage with the legislators before the change laws and not simply comment from the sideways decades afterwards.

This may in turn require the kind of radical overhaul of the core training at NEBOSH certificate and diploma levels, which are recognised for entry to the IOSH. For the mote in the eye of the safety and health profession, with Mr. Strange fails to acknowledge, is the comparative lack of education in social, diplomatic and political skills that members of the profession need to have the impact required with management, from day one. Mr. Strange's comments would have more credibility in the minds of members of the public serious about safety and health if he had acknowledged how far the profession he leads still has to go. The kind of strategic change I refer to is a very tough one; business psychologists have struggled with it for some time with marginal success. By contrast, the CIPD, in the 95th year of its history, has in the last six months shown publicly how this kind of major overhaul of basic training can be executed swiftly, where there is a will.

In short, good effort by Mr. Strange yeut FAR,. FAR greater ambition about raising the bar is ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL if IOSH amd the safety profession is ever going to have the social standing necessary to counter the negative press that is the focus of Mr. Strange's observations.
Yossarian  
#9 Posted : 17 March 2010 15:18:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Yossarian

I see RLJ has responded in this article about 2/3 of the way down:

http://www.dailymail.co....-minister-You-often.html

Should be interesting...
Anne Smart  
#10 Posted : 17 March 2010 15:21:36(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Guest

And here's Rob's response to Littlejohn's response...
http://bit.ly/ctcOrR

Anne Smart
IOSH media and campaigns co-ordinator
KieranD  
#11 Posted : 17 March 2010 16:29:03(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Guest

It's a shame for Mr. Strange to simply conduct a public argument at Littlejohn's level.

You don't read correspondence from the leaders of the medical, legal and other well-established professions which descends to the level of fourth-rate scribblers, whatever the provocation.

Unless the occupational safety and health can make much,much more robust cases for their competence, we are at risk of being judged by the standards of Littlejohn rather than those that Mr. Strange undoubtedly wishes to emulate.

Another good effort but this time misguided as well as sad.
redken  
#12 Posted : 17 March 2010 17:18:14(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
redken

I agree with Claire and it would also concern me that this is top of the list of real H&S concerns:

"Like fighting to prevent the looming spectre of more cancer caused by asbestos, a time-bomb that currently sees thousands of workers dying each year from past exposure"

How do we diffuse this time bomb, short of finding a cure for lung cancer caused by previous asbestos exposure.

I think most would agree that we are all ready doing an excellent job of preventing on going exposures, we are not in any fight on this that I am aware of.
jay  
#13 Posted : 17 March 2010 18:07:35(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jay

I am not too sure that the OSHA VPP is what it is publicised to be, especially after a crtical report from the US Government Accountability Office (equivalent of the NAO in UK?)

The report, either a summary or the full version can be viewed from:-
http://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-09-395

A typical review/auidt of a VPP or a potantial VPPP site involves 4 or more persons undertaking the on site review for 4 days--if adopted, who is going to fund for the resources??

As fsr as I am aware, OSHA has an overall budget of 558, 620 million dollars for the year 2010!! refer to:-
http://www.dol.gov/_sec/stratplan/2010/osha/2.htm

I am not advocating that VPP may not be a good programme, but it surely requires a huge amount of resourcing/funding and as the GAO has reported, OSHS does not seem to have reliable performance metrics on the effectivenness of the programme
Anne Smart  
#14 Posted : 18 March 2010 16:55:02(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Guest

Rob's piece in the Independent has also struck a chord with an Australian blogger. Read his post here: http://bit.ly/aiQtv7

Anne Smart
IOSH media and campaigns co-ordinator
RayRapp  
#15 Posted : 18 March 2010 18:29:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

Rob's article was good piece of journalism, well written, factual and in the main it reflects how the media portray health and safety. Nevertheless, a complete waste of time. Health and safety and those plying their trade in the industry have now been tainted with the 'elf n safety' mantra. We are as popular as merchant bankers and estate agents. The position will not alter until we recognise that health and safety laws and practices have become too restrictive - a view perhaps not popular with many of my colleagues, but there you go. The level of non-compliance with h&s laws by SMEs is nothing but scandalous. The fact is they get away with it and even when visited by an inspector all they get is a slap on the wrist, or at worst a frugal pecuniary sanction by the courts following a serious accident.

As Claire has already mentioned, there are far too many practitioners that are also over zealous and fuelling the h&s myth. Many these, of course, are jobsworths masquerading as h&s people in councils and other publicy funded institutions. That said, there enough of them out there to cause some serious damage to our industry. One only has to read some of the postings...enough said.
Users browsing this topic
Guest
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.