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safetyman2010  
#1 Posted : 15 April 2010 20:45:17(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
safetyman2010

Hi,

I started with my new company at turn of the year and have alot of issues to deal with at present. One major area is the implementation of a workable contractor mgt procedure. I have redesigned the procedure, introduced training for managers (Hiring and managing Contractor) and an H&S contractor Induction training course with Handbook of rules and procedures. I also introduced an assessment questionnaire to collect information on contractors H&S mgt system, training and provision of H&S competency which is all must be provided and reviewed before any contractor is permitted to work on site.

On of the controls used by previous H&S system was for a General Permit to Work for all contractors on site. This is general permit covering a wide range of issues. Now my opinion is that acts as nothing more than a 'paper' exercise with very little benefit. But i have no previous experience of using General Permit to Work so I thought i'd seek other opinions or experience on this system.

Thanks,
Steve Sedgwick  
#2 Posted : 16 April 2010 00:02:08(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Steve Sedgwick

It is difficult for us to comment without having a general view of your site / business and the details within this General Permit To Work (GPTW).

I have seen some Contractor GPTW systems that :-
a) acts as a contractor site access control system, ie on site / off site / job complete
b) helps the decision making on the requirements for any hazard specific permits for the task
c) ensures that risk assessments and method statements for the job are accepted and available

Your current system may have similar functions to the above and may not just be a "paper exercise".
Your proposals for change will have to replace these functions
Steve
David H  
#3 Posted : 16 April 2010 09:18:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
David H

Agree with Steve - diffficult to comment without seeing the site or document lay out.

I also dont see them as a "paper exercise". One of the benefits is that if the GPTW is issued by the area manager or supervisor, he is being made aware of any contractors coming into his area, and he is already aware of any works already in progress, so is aware and can manage any "conflicting work processes in his area. Ensure that sign off procedure is followed though!

From my experience though, for specific higher risk work such as WAH, Confined space entry, hot work etc, there should be a specific stand alone permit.

David.
David Bannister  
#4 Posted : 16 April 2010 10:34:54(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
David Bannister

Had a discuission with a client on this subject yesterday. They had been asked to implement a general contractors permit (but no mention of own work!). My advice was to base the need for a permit on the risks of the work. In that way the photocopier toner deliverer, water bottle deliverer, sanitary disposal person can carry on as usual whilst the roof fixer, welder and heavy machine installer will only do their work after a more in-depth consideration of how the work will be done and what controls need to be in place to prevent harm or damage, specified in a PTW, issued by the responsible manager

It remains to be seen whether the body who want the general PTW will accept my argument.
safetyman2010  
#5 Posted : 17 April 2010 15:11:23(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
safetyman2010

Thanks for your replies. We are a manufacturing factory with various activities such as machinery/equipt servicing; general maitenance of building fabrics and structures, maintenance tasks, silos and vats repairs and cleaning, deliveries of product and substances; etc.

We have task specific Permit to works to cover high risk activities, e.g. confined space, electrical works, working at height, breaking into lines, etc.

In my opinion the if we ensure only approved contractors are used, all contractors are inducted and sign off on company rules, risk assessments and method statements submitted and approved for their works and the contractor managed on site by designated site contact and issued PTW for any high risk activity then I do not see the need for another General Permit to Work document to be issued.

But I certainly appreciate any advice.
David H  
#6 Posted : 18 April 2010 16:15:05(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
David H

Safety - at the end of the day you are responsible for any contractors that come on your site.
Depending on the frequency of visits by contractors, could you not use an induction process to make people aware of the requirements. Produce a pocket card with the rules of the PTW system etc?
If contractor is a regular visitor, create a supervisors question sheet / score card / audit type check - that ensures that knowledge of the systems they are following is understood?

David
bob youel  
#7 Posted : 19 April 2010 08:15:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

general or specific permits are only any good/use if they are managed - a general PTW can be useful as its sets a standard for all but it needs to be enforced
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