Rank: Super forum user 
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During a fire risk assessment of a shop/workshop/offices etc. I spotted an under stairs cupboard containing some computer equipment - electrical - and the underside of the timber staircase is unprotected.
The stairs lead to a first floor flat above the ground floor and that is occupied by a mother and child.
I have previously spoken to a fire safety officer about this set up, one year ago when I carried out an initial fire risk assessment here, and he advised not to concern myself with the flat and just concentrate on the premises I am assessing.
OK he could be right but I believe there is a moral duty to protect the occupier of the flat and think fire protection should be installed to protect the staircase.
Half hour or one hour - that is the question?
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Rank: Super forum user 
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Be it nobbler in the mind to...
Oh Sorry! As it's sleeping accomodation above I'd be inclined to say half an hour isn't long enough.
Was the computer equipment in use or just being stored?
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Rank: Forum user 
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Hi Chris
The advice I have had from the Fire & Rescue Service regarding this type of issue is, the fire protection between domestic and commercial properties should be 1 hour. (Staircase and Ceiling).
Cheers
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Rank: Super forum user
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When you carried out the risk assessment, what was your finding re classification of fire risk low, normal or high?
Was the travel distance to a place of safety within acceptable limits 25m, 18m or 9m?
Was any form of fire/smoke detection provided?
Cant see the building owner providing a protected staircase when there is no legal requirement to do so.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Firesafetybod.
1 hour FR between commercial and domestic is required this does not necessarily apply to staircase, there would be no requirement providing the compartment walls and doors are 1 hour rated.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Hi bleve - Is this now an exam :-)
Fire risk low,
Travel distances all with acceptable limits,
Smoke alarm installed in the first floor flat,
I agree that the landlord may not wish to provide but the occupier of the ground floor is willing to have it done.
Please bear in mind this is not fire protection walls ceiling or floor but immediately beneath the stairs. Am I being a little ott?
I did a fra there last year and found lots of "main findings" for them to get sorted, which he did most of. This is new as the area involved was sealed last year but since opened up to form a cupboard.
My original topic mentioned the fire safety officer telling me to just concentrate on the premises I was assessing and not the flat above ???????
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Rank: Super forum user
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Chris,
It all depends, is there only one flat on the first floor?
Are there other storeys?
Is it a common stair case?
based on one flat scenario, no common stair, egress from the flat not passing thru kitchen/kitchenette, no solid fuel fire/heating, 1 hr Fr between commercial and domestic premises, then I would think additional fire protection of understair cupboard unnecessary.
But it depends on how you see it based on your perception at the time of inspection Vs a written description on this forum.
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Rank: Forum user
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Hi Chris
To add to my previous post.
The advice I had received from the FRS regarding this type of issue is, the fire protection between domestic and commercial properties should be 1 hour. (Staircase and Ceiling). The exposed underside of the staircase could be plaster-boarded and skimmed (ensuring no gaps and breaks into staircase structure)
Cheers
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Rank: Super forum user
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bleve - only one flat above and I have not been inside as it is private property. Single staircase leads direct to the exit door.
Firesafetybod - that's exactly what I thought should happen, plaster board skimmed.
The occupier of the g floor is willing to do it, I'll suggest a double layer of plaster board and see if he will agree.
Thanks for all the input, as usual some good stuff there.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Chris,
If you apply protection to the underside of the stair, you will also have to consider similar period of FR at the side of the stair and door to the cupboard area.
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Rank: Forum user
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I have to say that the Fire Officer who told you "not to bother" seems to have missed the point by miles. If a fire in the premises you are assessing will have an impact on neighbouring / adjacent premises then this is a legitimate subject for your risk assessment. The risk assessment is just that, you assess the risk and decide on what control measures should be in place. You may decide to adopt only the measures required by legislation and building standards (which always seems to be the approach of the FRS) but are they adequate in the circumstances? That is one of the main purposes of the risk assessment, i.e. to decide what controls need to be in place and it is your call!
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Rank: Super forum user
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I agree with the general advice given by Bleve and others and if I were doing the FRA I would recommend boarding the underside of the stairs as a minimum.
However the Fire officer's opinion brings up an interesting point if you look at the strict application of the FSO.
The Order does NOT apply to Domestic premises. It can be said that the flat forms a domestic premises separate from the workshop, etc below as it has its own spearate access. Therefore an argument can be made that any recommendations resulting from a FRA are not enforceable in respect of the prmises above the workshop.
Contrary to this it could be argued that the occupants of the flat are "relevant" persons ("any person in the immediate vicinity of the premises who is at risk from a fire on the premises") and thus the RP must "take such general fire precautions as may reasonably be required in the circumstances of the case to ensure that the premises are safe." in respect of such relevant persons.
I believe that this one has been argued for some time on various fire safety forums and the consensus is that the legislation in England and Wales is poorly drafted!
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Rank: Guest
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Of course the underside of the stairs have to be protected. The flat must have 1 hour separation from all sides. As for the fire officer, I am sad to hear that he said only concern yourself with the premises you are assessing. Your concern includes those within the premises plus those in the vicinity who may be affected by a fire in the premises. The mother and child may be affected so must be considered. The fire officer should know better.
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