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GeoffB4  
#1 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:00:27(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
GeoffB4

A company has two HGVs and two qualified HGV drivers. If a driver is not available in the company yard approved (by the company) non-HGV drivers shunt the lorries as necessary. We're talking strict 5mph limits, very short distances perhaps 10m, and a banksman when reversing - all contained within the company premises. Risk assessment is thorough and monitoring is carried out by senior management. Any comments?
firesafety101  
#2 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:06:07(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

I don't think risk assessment can be thorough if non qualified people do the driving.
Lexyboy  
#3 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:22:18(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
lexyboy

I have to agree with Chris on this one. There will be appropriate training courses for "shunting" vehicles. Unfortunately I dont know of any down in the south (I am based in Scotland and used LAGTA based in the Central Belt).
stevedm  
#4 Posted : 11 May 2010 11:35:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stevedm

If we are not careful we will drag up the old 'what is suitable and sufficient argument'. Site shunter training is available and endorsed by properly trained instructors and provides a company with a cost effective solution to the problem. I found this training extract from the net. 'The training of Non-HGV Drivers to drive maximum weight articulated and rigged vehicles ON-SITE ONLY around the company's premises. Trainees for these courses must have held a full car driving licence for at least one year. Drivers will be required to pick up and set down laden and un-laden trailers. Understand company safety procedures and adhere to employees responsibility concerning the Health & Safety at Work Act. Understand vehicle and trailer controls. Demonstrate ability to manoeuvre the shunter around the site, in particular reversing and trailer coupling and uncoupling, laden and un-laden. Course content includes:- HSE Workplace Transport Safety (INDG 199 rev1) Reversing Vehicles (INDG 148) and Parking Large Goods Vehicles Safely (INDG 312)'
GeoffB4  
#5 Posted : 11 May 2010 17:47:32(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
GeoffB4

Thanks Steve/Lexy for your constructive replies. I'll pursue the site shunter training angle.
Phillips20760  
#6 Posted : 17 May 2010 10:30:24(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Phillips20760

Apologies if you've already got the answer your looking for but... We went down the road of formal shunter training. The main reason for this wasn't to make sure the drivers were competent at driving HGV's (due to the nature of our industry, most were) but because of the risks of poor coupling and uncoupling. Unfortunately, poor coupling / uncoupling still causes a lot of workplace injuries and fatalities and poor practices such as 'dropping the red line' can be common in distribution yards. As steve posted, good, formal, shunter training courses will address this and other significant risks such as reversing vehicles, banksman singals etc. etc. Regards, Ian P.S. The training / competence section of "HSG 136: Workplace Transport" is worth digging out if you need more ammo to get the costs sanctioned...
Paul Duell  
#7 Posted : 17 May 2010 11:39:12(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Paul Duell

We did exactly what GeoffB4 describes at my last company - I believe it's standard practice in mnay industries, when there's a need for frequent yard shunting. We had our own in-company trainer, he was a qualified LPCV/HGV driver and FLT instructor/examiner, and he did all our FLT training and training of the yard shunter drivers, as well as pre-employment assessment drives of all our incoming HGV drivers. As far as I recall, in my twenty years with that company we never had an incident that could be attributed to our "yard shunter only" drivers - unlike some of our "real" HGV drivers who thought they knew it all. Geoff - is there a reason for your concern? If your company has been doing this for a while, the accident record will tell a lot of the story that you need. I'd be very hesitant about calling someone else's risk assessment "not thorough" without having even read it.
GeoffB4  
#8 Posted : 17 May 2010 12:34:29(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
GeoffB4

No accidents in 30 years of trading. No coupling or uncoupling. Reversing always with a banksman. 5 mphh applied and adhered to. Non HGV drivers (shunters) all have car licenses and are entitled to drive MGV upto 7.5 tonnes. All authorised 'shunters' have clean licenses. All drivers have been familiarised with the HGVs by the HGV drivers. Regular maintenance of vehicles and daily checkes. It is a large yard, with no customer vehicles, shared with 4 FLTs only and on and on an on..... I don't have any particular concern with this, or the RA which is thorough and quite adequate, but was asked the question by a client. We can justify the risk as being very low with the measures we have in place - which is what risk assessment is all about surely? Thanks Paul, I also wouldn't dream of stating an unseen RA was not thorough, which is why I ignored the comment.
wizzpete  
#9 Posted : 17 May 2010 12:55:19(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
wizzpete

I'm sure you've considered this, but would just add that the shunters should be regularly assessed for their competence as shunters. Also, I presume there is no coupling/uncoupling because the HGVs are Rigids? You should bear in mind also what the procedure is for a 'new' (replacement?) shunter who may not necessarily have the experience of the existing people. I would agree with you, Geoff, that as long as all the risks identified are ALARP in the RA, then you only need review them.
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