We insist that all our employee wear Hi Vis Vest around WPT. We provide them with the standard yellow variety. However, some of our more fashion conscious employees have purchased their own black ones consisting of a reflective stripe. To my mind these are only really useful at night in headlights etc., but they are still sold as "Hi-Vis" vests and that is afterall what we have insisted that employees wear. I suppose I could argue that as we stipulate them, we must also provide them, but I just wondered whether anyone else had any thoughts on the effectiveness of the black variety. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Thanks

Could you post a link to the black ones you are referring to as i don't think i've seen this type.

To my mind the bright yellow of the vest is what is going to get someone spotted if they are wondering around a construction site or warehouse. i don't think the reflective strips play a big part in this other than at night when car or other lights would reflect back to say the car driver. I can't see how a vest that is black could still be seen as high visibility when you are just relying on the reflective strip to know that the person is there as this would require a source of light in the correct direction.

Phil

You should be stating that the hivis conforms to EN471, this specifies the colourmetrics required. In fairness EN471 relates more to what is required for the highways and byways but if you specify it will ensure it is either yellow, orange or red that is worn on site. It all comes down to the amount of background material in relation to the reflective stripes so for the truly fashion conscious there is a little room for maneouvre on sleeved hi-vis. This allows for a certain amount of non-yellow material - hence you may occasionally see a jacket with blue trim around the cuffs and hem (areas most likely to get dirty). Apologies for rambling but hopefully it helps.

Yellow would be unsuitable in a custard factory, banana processing plant or a canary breeding establishment (still feeling Fridayish!)

I would suggest, as previously pointed out, that only clothing that complies with EN471 should be worn where an assessment has identified a need for them.

EN471 stipulates a combination of fluorescent material and retroreflective material.

Thanks

If you're the boss, make them wear yellow Hi Vis...and tell them it won't cost them a penny. Next thing they will want to turn their hard hats round the 'other way'...

Nobody can tell me that this type of vest is prefrable over a normal EN471 compliant vest, i dont care where their working.

A hi-vis vest provided exactly that, hi visability, on 2 fronts fluorescent material and retroreflective material, this vest IMO is a joke.

http://www.head2toesecur...ack-hi-viz-vest_full.jpg

How about carrying out your own wee experiment, using staff wearing the black vests and others wearing the yellow - maybe have a driver in a stationary vehicle and see if he could spot the two people in his mirrors?

Before anyone jumps on this post, I am *not* saying have forklifts and lorries zooming around the yard and send a couple of guinea pigs out and see if they get run over or not, tempting though it is............. :-)

Ha sounds fun! Although I doubt the result of any experiment or RA would advise anything other than EN471 clothing in external yard & traffic areas. This standard specifically details yellow, orange-red, or red.

Paul. My feeling is that your geezers are probably having a laugh at your expense. Whilst I am willing to argue that black in not natural, the truth is that I would not actually be happy if my staff were dressed in black and I would not be comfortable with it. It’s just not cricket. The answer is buy yellow or orange and be done. You (your company) should be doing that (buying them) anyway. Then draw the line and let your managers manage the situation. Good luck by the way.

As for black, yes I did physics at school as well so I agree it is not technically a colour, it’s an absence of colour, absorbing all light. But the fact is that black is NOT a prime natural colour in nature.
Black dogs and cows? Man made breeding programs.
Black panthers? A freak of nature with Jaguars. And they are not actually all black.
Bin bags and tyres? Manmade items that don’t grow on trees (however, natural rubber is greyish and comes from trees).

The RAF did an experiment with aircraft colours some time ago in the 1980’s. They concluded that grey blends in better with the background (any Man U fans out there remember the grey football shirts fiasco, designed so that fans would wear them with jeans? The players blended into the crowd and missed passes), but black (being an un-natural colour) stands out better than even red and/or orange (at all levels). Hence the reason why all British fixed wing combat aircraft are grey and "none combat" aircraft (including rotary winged) are; and have been since the early 1990's, painted black. This also includes most Police choppers. Now that fascinating school boy fact would be applicable if your staff were whizzing around at FL150 at 450kts, which I doubt.

I have three dogs. At night when let loose in a field the brown cocker vanishes first, then the white one. But even on the darkest nights the black cocker is still visible long after the other two have blended in.

Back on track and back to your question. It isn’t right and you have a good reason to be concerned. So I recommend that you ditch the black vests.

Cracking idea, LOL. Hi-vis vest are available for dogs along with flashing collars. NICE....

Reflective V's Hi-visability, I would have thought the easiest way to solve that one would be to have a PPE operating standard drafted, that actually goes into the specifics of the why's / when's / the what's etc, so your ploicy clearly acknowledges adherence to PPE standard and other specific operating standards, thus keeping the policy document lightweight.
Exactly what are the reasons for wearing reflective vests anyway? Are the warmer / cooler (temp not hip) / cooler (hip not temp.) / do they have pockets etc etc etc, or are the staff just f@rting in your face?

The pleasures of Elf & Safety know no bounds

If you state that Hi-vis is to be worn, then you (your employer) must supply it. You cannot expect an employee to provide safety equipment at their own expense that you stipulate must be worn. You supply it, manage its use and therefore have complete control over the specifications.

Do ladies not fall into this category?
Or is it just us men..... again....just a thought

Apologies I don't know why I started waffling on about no tops on men at the end there, must have subconsciously started thinking about the other thread on hi-viz and no top. What can I say, it's been a tough week!!!

Hi All,

Just to enlighten you all, a standard High Vis vest is actually Green, not Yellow :)

It was inevitable this would come up!!!!! DNW… colour is simple a shade and there are many factors affecting individual perception to the shade being interpreted… accordingly, you are not alone in your green analogy, but you are in the minority. Both beauty AND colour…. Is in the eye of the beholder!