Rank: Forum user
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I work for a group of companies and one of the premises, which happens to be a steel fabrication factory, has decided to stop using paper towels within the wash rooms and replaced them with normal towels.
Bearing in mind there are approximately 30 people using the same two towels I believe there is somewhat of a hygiene issue. Is anybody aware of similar cases or even any guidance notes etc on recommendations as I am a bit stumped on this one.
Sorry if this seems trivial but I have some very unhappy fabricators giving me grief.
Thanks Craig.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Craig
The Workplace Regs ACoP doesn't help but the guidance leaflet (http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg293.pdf) only mentions paper towels or hot air driers.
LB
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Rank: Super forum user
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Are we talking hygiene towel rolls, the ones that go round on a tube that you pull down on? If so these are perfectly adequate.
Have you thought of hand dryers, these can be more eco-friendly than towels?
Q. What was the reason for the change?
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Rank: Super forum user
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In the first place, i'd be somewhat sceptical about the frequency of hand washing but you can decide on that.
there is certainly opportunity for transfer of potential pathogens sharing a conventional towel and some transmission events have been described in family and institutional settings. It is so obvious a hygiene issue that such towels are eschewed in many situations, but that doesn't in itself make it inappropriate for your application. It is, however, unpleasant and inappropriate and you should try to do better, and probably save money too.
Is the problem cost + the mes made by used towels dropped everywhere? Who picks them up? How to dispose?
If so, the same issues will arise with towels, that will need to be in plentiful supply and laundered frequently. That too carries a not inconsequential cost and may in fact be more expensive than paper.
A good quality air dryer may be a welcome and cost-effective solution.
Clean, efficient, low maintenance, hygienic, tidy, kind to hands and cost-effective. What more do you need?
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Rank: Forum user
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freelance safety wrote:Are we talking hygiene towel rolls, the ones that go round on a tube that you pull down on? If so these are perfectly adequate.
Have you thought of hand dryers, these can be more eco-friendly than towels?
Q. What was the reason for the change?
No we are talking about standard hand towels the type you would use at home.
The reason for the change as outlined to me is that it was based on cost. The MD there for some reason believed that it is cheaper to get normal hand towels washed rather than use throw away paper towels. The problem is once she gets an idea into her head that is it. So I am looking for evidence against it rather than just my opinion.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Hi Craig, Ian has already provided some advice which I think would be useful. Actually it is cheaper to use a dryer than hand towels, so that’s one another case in your favour.
Obviously, cross-contamination from workers needs to be addressed, both from works activities and individuals. Lots of information on the sharing of towels and spreading infections and contagious diseases on the web, just do a simple search i.e. sharing of towels.
I doubt your director wants people off sick and potential claims at the door? A bit more costly than a hand-dryer.
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Rank: Super forum user
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I would disagree about hand dryers as I've been told they are less hygenic than paper towels as the heat promotes bacteria and most people do not dry their hands thoroughly with them. Personally I hate hand dryers. You may have noticed a shift in many places reverting back to hand towels.
Cotton hand towels do get used in businesses but usually only offices. If you have to go down that route then it would need frequent washing.
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If the 30 staff all require to dry their hands at the same time IE at knock off or piece time then paper towels are the best option, unless you are going to have a number of dryers fitted.
You could always make sure that the wet and manky cotton towel is placed into your Lady MD's toilet so she is forced to use it herself!!
See how long her idea lasts then!!
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Rank: Super forum user
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Yes, I agree with you Clairel. Some studies have shown that some dryers can create bacteria that is then passed on to individuals i.e. Westminster University Study. This does show that most of the issues are to do with poor maintenance, cleaning of the machines and heat settings.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Simple hand towels that are used by several people is not a method that any dermatologist would consider acceptable. As Ian has stated, there is considerable potential for cross contamination, not merely bacterial but also chemical. If the previous user has not rinsed their hands fully, then contamination still on the hands could be transferred to the towel. The next user will then come into contact with this. Suppose that that user is allergic to the particular contaminant!
Warm air driers have their place, but not, in my view, in an industrial/occupational washroom. Only one person can use them at a time and the time taken to dry the hands is considerable. Thus where there is short term, intensive washroom use, e.g. at the end of a shift, then unless a significant number is installed, workers will simply not wait long enough for a drier to become available. They must also be installed so that they draw in clean air. Recirculating bacteria and aerosol laden washroom air is not acceptable.
"If workers are using a substance which has a tendency to degrease the skin, a hot air drier may aggravate this problem..." - from Essentials of Industrial Dermatology, ISBN 0-632-00924-1
Paper towel can now be provided on rolls in machines similar to those used for linen towels. This eliminates the problem of disposal of individual paper towels. It also eliminates the possibility that towels will be taken for other purposes than hand drying. However, paper towel should be of good quality. Cheap paper towel is given wet strength by adding chemicals, some of which can actually cause skin problems.
Chris
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Rank: Guest
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Ordinary towels won't last five minutes in the environment outlined.
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Rank: Guest
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Great suggestion ref Dyson but how does he convince his boss she is wrong.
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I have used those Dyson Dryers, so good they make your hands feel like you have a new layer of skin!!!
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Rank: Super forum user
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I have a concern about the effect on the skin of the Dyson type drier (and there are others producing similar equipment) if hands are dried frequently. The principle is what, in industrial terms, might be described as an 'air knife'. A very high velocity flow of air is used to blast the moisture off the skin. My concern (and having discussed this with dermatologists this remains a concern) is that repeated exposure to such high velicoty air flow could affect the stratum corneum and thus the integrity of the skin. I did request information from Dyson but although they stated that this was not an issue they declined to let me see the actual studies they stated supported their claim.
In my experience they are also extremely noisy and, from personal use, do not always dry the skin as well as a good quality paper towel. This is not to say that, in some circumstances, they may not be the best alternative, but for the vast majority of situations I encounter the good quality paper towel is what I prefer to see clients use.
Chris
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Rank: Super forum user
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Yes, I’ve noted some external tests highlighting the issue of the aperture of the Dyson blade i. e. coming in to contact with hands and potential cross-contamination?
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Rank: Super forum user
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The Dyson is effective but very noisy, they have them at the BSC in Hammersmith and at the IOSH Grange near the training rooms. Mitsubishi also make one which is £400, Dyson is £600, it is also a lot quieter and thought to be more reliable
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How to convince the boss they are wrong? - I think taking one of the wonder towels after being used a few times by thirty employes and dropping in front of her on the desk and asking if they would use it themselves might be convincing. An obvious biological risk exists which risk assessment could not fail to classify as significant. Also regarding workplace regs. welfare requirements, a stinking, wet towel is not adequate provision for drying hands.
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Rank: Forum user
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Thanks all for the advice it certainly gives me some ammunition for my argument.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Q. did you look at the picture on the link, maybe you should print them out with the info?
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Various methods of hand-drying have advantages as well as disadvantages. Regarding the noise levels of the high speed hand driers (using some form of venturi effect to increase the flow velocity), if you consider the exposure period, it will be below any of the action levels/limits! I have carried out actual measurements.
However, I would consider use of any form of reusable towel, including the rotating dispensable type as a less hygienic option as there is a greater risk of spreading contamination.
Paper towels, including the recycled papaer ones generate waste.
Conventional Hand driers consume power and take fairly long to dry the hands.
The new high speed driers are effective, but "noisy".
It is a matter of balancing the advantages and disadvantages
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Rank: Super forum user
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Do please be aware of recommendations, for or against, made by those with a vested interest in the outcome.
Air blade dryers are highly efficient and no significant adverse effects on skin have been noted, even in the 'hot house' of the healthcsre sector.
Ridiculous suggests that it takes longer to dry hands with a good quality modern air dryer than with a paper towel are just that, ridiculous. Unless of course you are happy to accept wet hands after using and discarding the towel. That is a remarkably common event that we have all experienced and will be the cause of some later skin irritation in some individuals..
If it creates a bottleneck having a single air dryer, get two ... DOH! The same could be said about a single paper towel dispenser, or a single wash basin etc, so to raise such an issue serves only to obfuscate.
And please do beware of the 'Westminster University Study'. The data is unpublished in any peer-reviewed journal but has been repeatedly touted as an independent study when the reality is it is fully discredited and far from independent. In fact, it was commissioned and funded by the paper towel trade association! In that particular case, it really is not worth the paper it was written on.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Good pun at the end Ian.......!
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Rank: Super forum user
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It wasn't a pun, I meant it
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Rank: Guest
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Thank you Ian for the info. Nice to have the whole picture.
Ciaran
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