Rank: Super forum user
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Rank: Super forum user
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Rank: Guest
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Set light to a sign on a post in the street how far can that spread? Agree with Phil BIZARRE
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Rank: Super forum user
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Idiotic jobsworth springs to mind. Having said that, now that the press have printed this nonsense, I've no doubt there will be plenty of wasters willing to test the theory out (assuming they can read).
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Rank: Super forum user
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I will be interested in Bleve's opinion on this?
The sign is not on a post in the street it is on the front door, which is probably one of the fire exits from the building. Depending on the type of plastic used for the notice it may be a high fire hazard that could spread to the door itself and cut off the exit.
Lots of variables i.e. anything else on the door that would contribute, position of the notice on the door, i.e above or below the letterbox etc. etc.
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Rank: Super forum user
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If you allow one notice on the door where do you draw the line?
Whay I though was scary recently was the Green Party nailing their campaign posters to trees.
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Rank: Super forum user
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If this is the usual NW self adhesive sign which is just a few inches in diameter I cannot see how it could possibly be considered a fire risk.
Seems to be a 'one rule fits all' approach.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Assuming polythene self adhesive sticker .1 metre x .1 metre and .5 mm thick and Heat of Combustion of 44.6 MJ/Kg then Heat Release Rate is circa 4.46 kW.
Piloted (purposeful) ignition of timber is 10 kW/m2.
Risk of ignition based on sticker alone and projected time of burning is not a problem.
However,flaking/peeling oil based paint at the surface of the door and deliberate ignition of the sticker could result in combustion, similarly flaking/peeling paint on concrete block ot plaster board substrate could also result in surface flame spread.
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Rank: Super forum user
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bleve wrote:Assuming polythene self adhesive sticker .1 metre x .1 metre and .5 mm thick and Heat of Combustion of 44.6 MJ/Kg then Heat Release Rate is circa 4.46 kW.
Piloted (purposeful) ignition of timber is 10 kW/m2.
Risk of ignition based on sticker alone and projected time of burning is not a problem.
However,flaking/peeling oil based paint at the surface of the door and deliberate ignition of the sticker could result in combustion, similarly flaking/peeling paint on concrete block ot plaster board substrate could also result in surface flame spread.
All very fascinating I am sure. But the decision to remove the sign/sticker (if the story is as printed) is still ridiculous. Risk assessing is all about likelihood, impact and common sense. Yes, science is vital to support and influence decisions but not to lead them.
An accidental ignition would be challenging. The sticker's role in assisting the development/spread of an existing fire would be less than minimal and how the hell do you deliberately ignite a sticker of a door (unless you use a blowlamp)??
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Rank: Forum user
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Can't argue with the calculations above but experience and common sense tells me that if some little Scrote is going to deliberately set fire to the door then he'll find something a damn sight easier than a NW sticker stuck to the door to get it going. It is yet another example of a body using H&S as an excuse for a bad decision because they think no-one will question it.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Speechless! Surely removing the sticker will damage paint leaving wood exposed. What about the risk of assault to the removee when he / she is out and about in this risky neighbourhood? What about the environmental impact of the wasted signage.
(apparently not speechless!)
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Rank: Forum user
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It certainly seems that there has been a bit of over zealous application of the fire precautions.
The clue is that this refers to a block of flats. In recent times there have been several serious fires in blocks of flats some of which have been reported in the national media. As a result many Councils have had to look at their fire safety arrangements again in similar premises.
Here's a link to another news article on the subject.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/new...-england-sussex-10750782
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Rank: Super forum user
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just wondering how many signs, stickers are stuck to the outside of doors warning people to keep access clear as it is a fire door or an escape route etc probably millions and I wonder how many have been the source of a fire ZERO.
I think they would be better securing the refuse bins and picking litter of the floor as that is more likely to be used as a combustible material as opposed to a sticker on a door.
Phil
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Rank: Forum user
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Surely the sticker is somewhat smaller than the average fire exit sign? Given that they are made of similar materials, if we apply the same logic, do we remove the fire signs too?
Bizzare, just bizzare...
Richard
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I have come across issues such as this in the fire risk assessments carried out for social housing providers.
After recent events where tenants have been killed social housing providers have gone in to panic mode and have had FRAs carried out for a lot of various properties in a very short space of time. The standard of a lot of these FRAs is some what dubious at best. They high light this and that as a significant risk when it clearly in not.
There's a couple of old sayings "you get what you pay for" & "pay peanuts get monkeys".
Competent Assessors would look at the whole picture not just tick a box.
The client needs educating and the incompetent assessor needs taking out the back and shooting (a bit dramatic I know). It is because of the poor standards of FRAs that these silly stories get in to the press.
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