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cres  
#1 Posted : 22 September 2010 13:09:41(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
cres

Hi We have lorry's that occasional have to reverse past an area that is used by members of the public for parking. We can not avoid it there is no alternative the HSE are aware of the activity and so they have suggested that we train our staff to act as reversing assistants to ensure members of the public do not stray into the path of the lorry's the route is directly backwards with no turns or blind spots so the lorry drivers really do not need assistance to reverse they just need to be sure no one is in their way. Does any one have a method statement or banksman training notes I could have a sneak peek at just to ensure I have covered every thing in mine as there is little / no information on the net and I don't need full banksman training as we really just need people more to ensure that members of the public do not stray into the path of a reversing vehicle as opposed to assisting the vehicle it self back but I just want to ensure by asking our staff to assist they are not themselves place in danger. I have found the banksman signals on the HSE website but no other information seems to be available. Any help greatly appreciated. Regards Cres
JYoung  
#2 Posted : 22 September 2010 13:29:56(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
JYoung

I would suggest that having someone or some persons trained as Banksmen would be advisable, just means that if there should happen to be an accident there is proof of competency. I worked on a construction site and still insisted on reversing lorries / plant having banksmen even if it was a straight reversing situation.
bob youel  
#3 Posted : 22 September 2010 14:00:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

Apparently the new term for such reversing areas/actions on the public highway or accross / through it is 'reversing assistant' as against banksman either way look at your own competence and go from there as its a basic activity and there's lots of info on the web re 'banksman' so take things from there Examples to think about; The 'reversing assistant' wears a high vis tabard or glove [for the hand signals], walk keeping with an eye on the vehicle as well as the footpath, ensure that drivers know that the 'reversing assistant' is a responsible person and that they should take notice of their guidance, use of whistle etc are all things to consider as well as undertaking a risk asessment and if you feel that the risk is low stay with your judgement and do not use 'reversing assistants' at that location
Ron Hunter  
#4 Posted : 22 September 2010 15:20:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

You say: "the lorry drivers really do not need assistance to reverse they just need to be sure no one is in their way". That's a wee bit concerning as you express it. Pedestrians will always have right-of-way, and the driver must know to obey the instructions of the banksman. The banskman needs training on signals and positioning to ensure he is always visible, similarly your drivers need to know they must stop if they lose sight of the banksman in his mirrors. I would expect (as a minimum) a reversing sounder fitted to all your vehicles and I am greatly surprised that an HSE inspector did not insist on the retro-fitting of cameras and cab-mounted monitors to your fleet. These are not expensive and would be well within the realms of reasonable practicability. Are all these lorries and drivers your own people, or do you have others to bring into this arrangement? That could get complicated! Appropriate training is available via CITB Constructionskills.
Steve Sedgwick  
#5 Posted : 22 September 2010 17:01:45(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Steve Sedgwick

Cres if the Inspector advised Reversing Assistants the stick to that, there is probably a good reason why Banksmen were not insisted on. Particularly if the drivers are not your employees I have known businesses exporting or importing products world wide, in these cases you can be dealing with an International Fleet forwarder where many drivers do not understand English. If you train Banksmen then you need to train the drivers being banked to ensure that they understand the signals and rules. A Banksman gets involved in directing the lorry / driver and are at higher risk of traffic accident than a Reversing Assistant prime duties are to stand in a safe place and make sure everyone else keeps clear when any reversing takes place. Steve
Ian A-H  
#6 Posted : 22 September 2010 17:52:21(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Ian A-H

Cres Look in the Waste and Recycling section of the HSE's website they have some excellent resources, in particular http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/waste04.pdf look in the Reversing section. Banksmen have very tightly defined responsibilities and need a fair bit of training. Reversing Assistants are there purely for safety - there are only 2 signals STOP! GO! Using the HSE's stuff you can easily knock up a one hour training session including a practical. Kettering Council used to make information available including Powerpoint presentations. They took the lead on this following a tradgedy and subsequent prosecution. Have a look on their website. Ian
DEEPAK PATEL  
#7 Posted : 22 September 2010 19:00:02(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
DEEPAK PATEL

Visit the public fire service, they will show easy signal for parking
Ron Hunter  
#8 Posted : 22 September 2010 23:19:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

Ian, that HSE Guide is a good read, and some good guidance, but how does the warning expressed at page 17 fit in with a reasonable practicability argument? It reads to me as: "It's OK to reverse........but not too far. Reverse too far and people may die" How is anyone to quantify that?
lewes  
#9 Posted : 23 September 2010 09:00:48(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
lewes

We have also had to look at this as we have a similar problem. With us the HSE didn't actually say we needed a "Reversing Assistant" but to consider it as there is always the possibility of entrapment/crushing when reversing. On one of our sites we opted for a reversing area with no pedestrian access permitted. The biggest problem is to make sure the Driver and the Assistant have had the same training otherwise the driver maybe taking the wrong actions. I know talking to some of our drivers is was felt that a "Reversing Assistant" wasn't necessarily needed as the driver knows the dimensions of the vehicle but there was a need for an assistant to keep pedestrians out of the reversing area. So more of a "Pedestrian Assistant" to control access but also to ensure they are visible.
cres  
#10 Posted : 23 September 2010 09:54:10(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
cres

Thanks for all your help guys, It really is appreciated, all points have been taken on board. Once again thank you for your help. Kind Regards Cres
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